What about Drake Maye?

[Beef Supreme]

if it's a muscle memory thing with maye than it's not an easy fix.

Tons of players have successfully altered their mechanics to improve their careers. Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tony Romo, Tom Brady and many others have done so.


Quarterback prospects get put under such a ridiculous microscope it’s just silly. There isn’t a prospect in the entire draft who doesn’t have things to change or rework or improve on if they want to achieve their potential.* Nobody rips Jer’Zhan Newton because he needs to improve his burst off the line, but he does. We simply acknowledge that and say his other elite traits will still shine through and maybe he can even improve his burst with better coaching and training. But despite that, I’d love to add Newton to the Vikings. Nobody says not to draft Chop Robinson because he needs to get stronger, but he does. Sure, strength can be added pretty easily in the NFL, but will he lose agility and flexibility if he does? No guarantee there either. But I’d take him.


We’re definitely at the point in the draft hype when we are dissecting minutia to the point where we can convince ourselves that none of these guys will be any good at all and we shouldn’t draft anyone.



* With the possible exception of Marvin Harrison Jr.

it's difficult but doable. i think of it akin to a golfer rebuilding his swing. it takes a lot of hard work--but golfers can do it. tiger did. more than once.

some can't though.

Right. And that’s true of everyone in the draft about something.


Lots of basketball players have reworked their jumpsuit form too. Pitchers have reworked their arm angles, balance, and release. Batters have changed their swings. It can be done.

[weimy froob]

Tons of players have successfully altered their mechanics to improve their careers. Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Tony Romo, Tom Brady and many others have done so.


Quarterback prospects get put under such a ridiculous microscope it’s just silly. There isn’t a prospect in the entire draft who doesn’t have things to change or rework or improve on if they want to achieve their potential.* Nobody rips Jer’Zhan Newton because he needs to improve his burst off the line, but he does. We simply acknowledge that and say his other elite traits will still shine through and maybe he can even improve his burst with better coaching and training. But despite that, I’d love to add Newton to the Vikings. Nobody says not to draft Chop Robinson because he needs to get stronger, but he does. Sure, strength can be added pretty easily in the NFL, but will he lose agility and flexibility if he does? No guarantee there either. But I’d take him.


We’re definitely at the point in the draft hype when we are dissecting minutia to the point where we can convince ourselves that none of these guys will be any good at all and we shouldn’t draft anyone.



* With the possible exception of Marvin Harrison Jr.

it's difficult but doable. i think of it akin to a golfer rebuilding his swing. it takes a lot of hard work--but golfers can do it. tiger did. more than once.

some can't though.

Right. And that’s true of everyone in the draft about something.


Lots of basketball players have reworked their jumpsuit form too. Pitchers have reworked their arm angles, balance, and release. Batters have changed their swings. It can be done.

the red flag that some are having with maye is that he's having trouble with the throws that should be second nature to him right now and which absolutely have to be second nature to a successful QB at the next level. the other thing about correcting these things is that they have to be fixed while the QB is put under duress from time to time. the duress that a golfer has is simply between his ears. not with a guy trying to crimp him with a hit to the ribs.

we'll see how it all plays out in a couple of years.

[Beef Supreme]

it's difficult but doable. i think of it akin to a golfer rebuilding his swing. it takes a lot of hard work--but golfers can do it. tiger did. more than once.

some can't though.

Right. And that’s true of everyone in the draft about something.


Lots of basketball players have reworked their jumpsuit form too. Pitchers have reworked their arm angles, balance, and release. Batters have changed their swings. It can be done.

the red flag that some are having with maye is that he's having trouble with the throws that should be second nature to him right now and which absolutely have to be second nature to a successful QB at the next level. the other thing about correcting these things is that they have to be fixed while the QB is put under duress from time to time. the duress that a golfer has is simply between his ears. not with a guy trying to crimp him with a hit to the ribs.

we'll see how it all plays out in a couple of years.

Click here to learn how to add YouTube Videos to your phpBB forum


Matt Ryan likes him. His #2 QB. Expert opinions are not unanimous. Ryan ought to know a thing or two about quarterback play. Compares him to Trevor Lawrence. McFadden says he reminds him of Justin Herbert. Both say he'll be a better pro than he was a college player. They also acknowledge that landing spot for him will be key.

[Beef Supreme]

Some of the Drake Maye slander lately makes me think we should just sit tight at 11 and let him fall to us, right? Certainly if we can see it, NFL teams can see it too, right? Are we predicting him to slide? In many drafts, someone slides. Maybe Maye is the guy this year? Anyone want to make a bold prediction on that?

[weimy froob]

Some of the Drake Maye slander lately makes me think we should just sit tight at 11 and let him fall to us, right? Certainly if we can see it, NFL teams can see it too, right? Are we predicting him to slide? In many drafts, someone slides. Maybe Maye is the guy this year? Anyone want to make a bold prediction on that?

i'm fine with washington taking him. that was the consensus a couple of months ago.

[Beef Supreme]

Some of the Drake Maye slander lately makes me think we should just sit tight at 11 and let him fall to us, right? Certainly if we can see it, NFL teams can see it too, right? Are we predicting him to slide? In many drafts, someone slides. Maybe Maye is the guy this year? Anyone want to make a bold prediction on that?

i'm fine with washington taking him. that was the consensus a couple of months ago.

Why would they take him with all these horrible flaws?


Oh, you must mean in the 2nd round. Gotcha.

[Beef Supreme]

Click here to learn how to add YouTube Videos to your phpBB forum

He's Mel's #7 overall prospect (this is irrespective of positional value). Maye convo starts at about the 34-minute mark. The other guy ends the Maye segment echoing what I've been talking about regarding the over-analysis of players in general and Maye in particular. Anyway, Mel says give him a year to learn (like Mahomes had a year) and let him go and he'll be great.

FYI, the prospects he rated as higher than Maye were:

6 - TE Brock Bowers
5 - WR Rome Odunze
4 - WR Malik Nabers
3 - WR Marvin Harrison Jr.
2 - QB Jayden Daniels
1 - QB Caleb Williams


I think it's very easy to justify the QB premium and say Maye is the third most valuable prospect in this draft. Bowers, Odunze, Nabers, and Harrison are all great prospects, but none will make the difference to a team that a good quarterback will.

[RubeTube]

Click here to learn how to add YouTube Videos to your phpBB forum

He's Mel's #7 overall prospect (this is irrespective of positional value). Maye convo starts at about the 34-minute mark. The other guy ends the Maye segment echoing what I've been talking about regarding the over-analysis of players in general and Maye in particular. Anyway, Mel says give him a year to learn (like Mahomes had a year) and let him go and he'll be great.

FYI, the prospects he rated as higher than Maye were:

6 - TE Brock Bowers
5 - WR Rome Odunze
4 - WR Malik Nabers
3 - WR Marvin Harrison Jr.
2 - QB Jayden Daniels
1 - QB Caleb Williams


I think it's very easy to justify the QB premium and say Maye is the third most valuable prospect in this draft. Bowers, Odunze, Nabers, and Harrison are all great prospects, but none will make the difference to a team that a good quarterback will.

I think he’s going #2.

[Beef Supreme]

Hodge said similar things about Herbert as he’s saying about Maye.

[William Munny]

Hodge said similar things about Herbert as he’s saying about Maye.

Hodge was also one that said that CJ Stroud was going to be very good prior to last years draft.

[Beef Supreme]

Hodge said similar things about Herbert as he’s saying about Maye.

Hodge was also one that said that CJ Stroud was going to be very good prior to last years draft.

He was. I acknowledged that earlier. He has hits and misses like all these goofballs.

[Beef Supreme]

Dan was one of the worst QBs I can remember in the NFL, but I’ve always liked his analysis.

[William Munny]

Dan was one of the worst QBs I can remember in the NFL, but I’ve always liked his analysis.

That looked pretty bad. I get that it can be fixed, but can Maye fix it and actually use the improve fundamentals when under fire? This seems to be as much a mental issue as much as fundamental issue. Being able to tamper down the anxiety/enthusiasm during the moment.

[D_H]

Looks like Maye too much smoke. I’d stay at 11 and steal Penix but…


https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/ ... t.amp.html

[Da Gas Man's Ghost]

Now that it seems like Daniels is the heavy frontrunner for #2, it comes down to whether or not the Patriots like Maye. I sense that they wanted Daniels and not Maye. The recent reports that they are happy about either Maye or Daniels smells like an attempt to induce a nicer package for the #3.

It would take the three firsts to get to 3, obviously. But now it seems like it will take a kicker and NE is trying to get a nice kicker. They aren't getting another first, I think. But they could want a 3rd. By getting rid of their second, the Vikings might have helped themselves. The Patriots can't hold out for a 2nd that isn't there. It's counterintuitive but it happens.

[Da Gas Man's Ghost]

Dan was one of the worst QBs I can remember in the NFL, but I’ve always liked his analysis.

I've always felt Maye's issue is that he tries. He should do or do not.

[cunningham]

Now that it seems like Daniels is the heavy frontrunner for #2, it comes down to whether or not the Patriots like Maye. I sense that they wanted Daniels and not Maye. The recent reports that they are happy about either Maye or Daniels smells like an attempt to induce a nicer package for the #3.

It would take the three firsts to get to 3, obviously. But now it seems like it will take a kicker and NE is trying to get a nice kicker. They aren't getting another first, I think. But they could want a 3rd. By getting rid of their second, the Vikings might have helped themselves. The Patriots can't hold out for a 2nd that isn't there. It's counterintuitive but it happens.

Didn’t they sign Osborn so we’d get an extra 3rd comp pick? They have to justify this trade to their fans as well. Getting 3 firsts and a 3rd would make their fan base happy. I agree they wanted Daniels as that was the report a few months ago. Mac Jones was a better prospect and he didn’t work out. Taking the 3rd best QB again for them might not be as appealing.

Also, that 1st round pick next year coupled with their own could get them back to the top in next year’s draft.

If the Pats take Maye and don’t take our picks it would not be a the smart move. The fans would like it, which their owner confirmed, but all those picks would let them build back up fast. They could then take Nix at 11 for now. Or McCarthy.

I won’t be bummed if we end up with McCarthy though. He still might be good. But outside of Daniels or Williams there isn’t a day 1 starting QB on the draft. Is Maye worth it? Are we desperate?

I don’t mind trading the picks. It is a king’s ransom, but who’s to say we don’t end up with busts anyway?

Part of the issue is that we don’t take more quarterbacks higher in the draft. The teams at the top all have taken top quarterbacks recently.

[minnemike]

The thing about Daniels at #2, would WAS still have nightmares about a QB that could get injured again like RGIII did? I have a feeling they might wind up drafting Maye or McCarthy.

[Oriole81]

The thing about Daniels at #2, would WAS still have nightmares about a QB that could get injured again like RGIII did? I have a feeling they might wind up drafting Maye or McCarthy.

Everybody is different there. It's even different ownership.

[Da Gas Man's Ghost]

Now that it seems like Daniels is the heavy frontrunner for #2, it comes down to whether or not the Patriots like Maye. I sense that they wanted Daniels and not Maye. The recent reports that they are happy about either Maye or Daniels smells like an attempt to induce a nicer package for the #3.

It would take the three firsts to get to 3, obviously. But now it seems like it will take a kicker and NE is trying to get a nice kicker. They aren't getting another first, I think. But they could want a 3rd. By getting rid of their second, the Vikings might have helped themselves. The Patriots can't hold out for a 2nd that isn't there. It's counterintuitive but it happens.

Didn’t they sign Osborn so we’d get an extra 3rd comp pick? They have to justify this trade to their fans as well. Getting 3 firsts and a 3rd would make their fan base happy. I agree they wanted Daniels as that was the report a few months ago. Mac Jones was a better prospect and he didn’t work out. Taking the 3rd best QB again for them might not be as appealing.

Also, that 1st round pick next year coupled with their own could get them back to the top in next year’s draft.

If the Pats take Maye and don’t take our picks it would not be a the smart move. The fans would like it, which their owner confirmed, but all those picks would let them build back up fast. They could then take Nix at 11 for now. Or McCarthy.

I won’t be bummed if we end up with McCarthy though. He still might be good. But outside of Daniels or Williams there isn’t a day 1 starting QB on the draft. Is Maye worth it? Are we desperate?

I don’t mind trading the picks. It is a king’s ransom, but who’s to say we don’t end up with busts anyway?

Part of the issue is that we don’t take more quarterbacks higher in the draft. The teams at the top all have taken top quarterbacks recently.

Is your opinion colored by your personal opinion of Maye's future prospects? (not that it means that you are wrong and you might be perfectly accurate about Maye)

[Da Gas Man's Ghost]

The thing about Daniels at #2, would WAS still have nightmares about a QB that could get injured again like RGIII did? I have a feeling they might wind up drafting Maye or McCarthy.

I agree with Oriole. Long time ago.

Also, they destroyed RG3. They used him like a RB. (The Bears did the same thing with Fields but that could be all that Fields has.)

I expect they would think to use Daniels like Lamar. But it is interesting to note the similarities between Daniels and RG3.

[Beef Supreme]

Now that it seems like Daniels is the heavy frontrunner for #2, it comes down to whether or not the Patriots like Maye. I sense that they wanted Daniels and not Maye. The recent reports that they are happy about either Maye or Daniels smells like an attempt to induce a nicer package for the #3.

It would take the three firsts to get to 3, obviously. But now it seems like it will take a kicker and NE is trying to get a nice kicker. They aren't getting another first, I think. But they could want a 3rd. By getting rid of their second, the Vikings might have helped themselves. The Patriots can't hold out for a 2nd that isn't there. It's counterintuitive but it happens.

Didn’t they sign Osborn so we’d get an extra 3rd comp pick? They have to justify this trade to their fans as well. Getting 3 firsts and a 3rd would make their fan base happy. I agree they wanted Daniels as that was the report a few months ago. Mac Jones was a better prospect and he didn’t work out. Taking the 3rd best QB again for them might not be as appealing.

Also, that 1st round pick next year coupled with their own could get them back to the top in next year’s draft.

If the Pats take Maye and don’t take our picks it would not be a the smart move. The fans would like it, which their owner confirmed, but all those picks would let them build back up fast. They could then take Nix at 11 for now. Or McCarthy.

I won’t be bummed if we end up with McCarthy though. He still might be good. But outside of Daniels or Williams there isn’t a day 1 starting QB on the draft. Is Maye worth it? Are we desperate?

I don’t mind trading the picks. It is a king’s ransom, but who’s to say we don’t end up with busts anyway?

Part of the issue is that we don’t take more quarterbacks higher in the draft. The teams at the top all have taken top quarterbacks recently.

Mac Jones was a better prospect than who? Drake Maye? No he wasn’t.

[minnemike]

The thing about Daniels at #2, would WAS still have nightmares about a QB that could get injured again like RGIII did? I have a feeling they might wind up drafting Maye or McCarthy.

Everybody is different there. It's even different ownership.

Really talking about the optics of it with the fan base. I mean, it might be the same lesson to learn for the new regime.... or not.

[cunningham]

Now that it seems like Daniels is the heavy frontrunner for #2, it comes down to whether or not the Patriots like Maye. I sense that they wanted Daniels and not Maye. The recent reports that they are happy about either Maye or Daniels smells like an attempt to induce a nicer package for the #3.

It would take the three firsts to get to 3, obviously. But now it seems like it will take a kicker and NE is trying to get a nice kicker. They aren't getting another first, I think. But they could want a 3rd. By getting rid of their second, the Vikings might have helped themselves. The Patriots can't hold out for a 2nd that isn't there. It's counterintuitive but it happens.

Didn’t they sign Osborn so we’d get an extra 3rd comp pick? They have to justify this trade to their fans as well. Getting 3 firsts and a 3rd would make their fan base happy. I agree they wanted Daniels as that was the report a few months ago. Mac Jones was a better prospect and he didn’t work out. Taking the 3rd best QB again for them might not be as appealing.

Also, that 1st round pick next year coupled with their own could get them back to the top in next year’s draft.

If the Pats take Maye and don’t take our picks it would not be a the smart move. The fans would like it, which their owner confirmed, but all those picks would let them build back up fast. They could then take Nix at 11 for now. Or McCarthy.

I won’t be bummed if we end up with McCarthy though. He still might be good. But outside of Daniels or Williams there isn’t a day 1 starting QB on the draft. Is Maye worth it? Are we desperate?

I don’t mind trading the picks. It is a king’s ransom, but who’s to say we don’t end up with busts anyway?

Part of the issue is that we don’t take more quarterbacks higher in the draft. The teams at the top all have taken top quarterbacks recently.

Is your opinion colored by your personal opinion of Maye's future prospects? (not that it means that you are wrong and you might be perfectly accurate about Maye)

I hope we get Maye. That is my relational about why the Pats would pass him up.

I don’t like 2 firsts for JJ McCarthy. But I feel like someone will take him before 11 if we are sitting there.

If we got #23 and don’t get Maye it feels like kind of a failure. Is McCarty better than next year’s crop? Should we trade for a first from a team from next year?

I guess I just wish we did this more. We have never taken a quarterback higher than 11 in our history. For Teams at the top this is their second time in the last few years… I wish we had this many shots at the best ones instead of praying for a miracle that the 3rd best falls to us.

[cunningham]

Now that it seems like Daniels is the heavy frontrunner for #2, it comes down to whether or not the Patriots like Maye. I sense that they wanted Daniels and not Maye. The recent reports that they are happy about either Maye or Daniels smells like an attempt to induce a nicer package for the #3.

It would take the three firsts to get to 3, obviously. But now it seems like it will take a kicker and NE is trying to get a nice kicker. They aren't getting another first, I think. But they could want a 3rd. By getting rid of their second, the Vikings might have helped themselves. The Patriots can't hold out for a 2nd that isn't there. It's counterintuitive but it happens.

Didn’t they sign Osborn so we’d get an extra 3rd comp pick? They have to justify this trade to their fans as well. Getting 3 firsts and a 3rd would make their fan base happy. I agree they wanted Daniels as that was the report a few months ago. Mac Jones was a better prospect and he didn’t work out. Taking the 3rd best QB again for them might not be as appealing.

Also, that 1st round pick next year coupled with their own could get them back to the top in next year’s draft.

If the Pats take Maye and don’t take our picks it would not be a the smart move. The fans would like it, which their owner confirmed, but all those picks would let them build back up fast. They could then take Nix at 11 for now. Or McCarthy.

I won’t be bummed if we end up with McCarthy though. He still might be good. But outside of Daniels or Williams there isn’t a day 1 starting QB on the draft. Is Maye worth it? Are we desperate?

I don’t mind trading the picks. It is a king’s ransom, but who’s to say we don’t end up with busts anyway?

Part of the issue is that we don’t take more quarterbacks higher in the draft. The teams at the top all have taken top quarterbacks recently.

Mac Jones was a better prospect than who? Drake Maye? No he wasn’t.

Better stats his last year of college. Seemed at the time like he was the best to come out of his school and hopes were high.

[Beef Supreme]

Didn’t they sign Osborn so we’d get an extra 3rd comp pick? They have to justify this trade to their fans as well. Getting 3 firsts and a 3rd would make their fan base happy. I agree they wanted Daniels as that was the report a few months ago. Mac Jones was a better prospect and he didn’t work out. Taking the 3rd best QB again for them might not be as appealing.

Also, that 1st round pick next year coupled with their own could get them back to the top in next year’s draft.

If the Pats take Maye and don’t take our picks it would not be a the smart move. The fans would like it, which their owner confirmed, but all those picks would let them build back up fast. They could then take Nix at 11 for now. Or McCarthy.

I won’t be bummed if we end up with McCarthy though. He still might be good. But outside of Daniels or Williams there isn’t a day 1 starting QB on the draft. Is Maye worth it? Are we desperate?

I don’t mind trading the picks. It is a king’s ransom, but who’s to say we don’t end up with busts anyway?

Part of the issue is that we don’t take more quarterbacks higher in the draft. The teams at the top all have taken top quarterbacks recently.

Mac Jones was a better prospect than who? Drake Maye? No he wasn’t.

Better stats his last year of college. Seemed at the time like he was the best to come out of his school and hopes were high.

He played for Alabama! He was throwing to Jalen Waddle and Devonta Smith! He had Alex Leatherwood and Landon Dickerson on his line! He was handing off to Najee Harris!

Tanner Morgan could have good stats with that support.

[RubeTube]

Mac Jones was a better prospect than who? Drake Maye? No he wasn’t.

Better stats his last year of college. Seemed at the time like he was the best to come out of his school and hopes were high.

He played for Alabama! He was throwing to Jalen Waddle and Devonta Smith! He had Alex Leatherwood and Landon Dickerson on his line! He was handing off to Najee Harris!

Tanner Morgan could have good stats with that support.

I don’t know that I would go that far but I get the point.

[cunningham]

Mac Jones was a better prospect than who? Drake Maye? No he wasn’t.

Better stats his last year of college. Seemed at the time like he was the best to come out of his school and hopes were high.

He played for Alabama! He was throwing to Jalen Waddle and Devonta Smith! He had Alex Leatherwood and Landon Dickerson on his line! He was handing off to Najee Harris!

Tanner Morgan could have good stats with that support.

Fine. Rain on the parade Beef!

It feels more and more likely that the Pats take Maye and we trade up for McCarthy. I was just trying to find reasons why they would trade down with us.

I feel like Maye will struggle in NE just like Mac Jones did. They are putting the cart before the carriage and probably setting Maye up for failure. Meanwhile we end up with JJ and take years grooming him to be viable.

No to say being picked by the Patriots is a death sentence like going to the Bears or Panthers would be, but Maye will be rushed out and set up to fail. Here he would get to marinate and learn the game with less pressure.

[Beef Supreme]

Better stats his last year of college. Seemed at the time like he was the best to come out of his school and hopes were high.

He played for Alabama! He was throwing to Jalen Waddle and Devonta Smith! He had Alex Leatherwood and Landon Dickerson on his line! He was handing off to Najee Harris!

Tanner Morgan could have good stats with that support.

Fine. Rain on the parade Beef!

It feels more and more likely that the Pats take Maye and we trade up for McCarthy. I was just trying to find reasons why they would trade down with us.

I feel like Maye will struggle in NE just like Mac Jones did. They are putting the cart before the carriage and probably setting Maye up for failure. Meanwhile we end up with JJ and take years grooming him to be viable.

No to say being picked by the Patriots is a death sentence like going to the Bears or Panthers would be, but Maye will be rushed out and set up to fail. Here he would get to marinate and learn the game with less pressure.

In one of these threads I linked an article from NE sports media about why they should NOT take a QB (Maye or otherwise) and build up their roster. It was just an opinion piece, but it made the same argument you are making.

It’s not insanity to assert that New England’s roster is not suited to draft a top QB yet and Minnesota’s is. There’s a reason a number of pundits are saying the best QB coming out of this draft will be the one the Vikings pick.

[Small Hands]

He played for Alabama! He was throwing to Jalen Waddle and Devonta Smith! He had Alex Leatherwood and Landon Dickerson on his line! He was handing off to Najee Harris!

Tanner Morgan could have good stats with that support.

Fine. Rain on the parade Beef!

It feels more and more likely that the Pats take Maye and we trade up for McCarthy. I was just trying to find reasons why they would trade down with us.

I feel like Maye will struggle in NE just like Mac Jones did. They are putting the cart before the carriage and probably setting Maye up for failure. Meanwhile we end up with JJ and take years grooming him to be viable.

No to say being picked by the Patriots is a death sentence like going to the Bears or Panthers would be, but Maye will be rushed out and set up to fail. Here he would get to marinate and learn the game with less pressure.

In one of these threads I linked an article from NE sports media about why they should NOT take a QB (Maye or otherwise) and build up their roster. It was just an opinion piece, but it made the same argument you are making.

It’s not insanity to assert that New England’s roster is not suited to draft a top QB yet and Minnesota’s is. There’s a reason a number of pundits are saying the best QB coming out of this draft will be the one the Vikings pick.

It’s a very good argument, and one that was made at the beginning stages of the path to the draft, but QB hysteria is real, and there are no guarantees that NE will be drafting this high in a 3 deep QB draft again. There has been no reports of them considering moving. In fact, it’s been dead silent from all top 3 teams, right?