Wilks

[hategreenticemase]

Does anyone else think this is as fucked up as I do? Imo Shanahan looks ridiculous with this move. Offense and ST had way more to do with losing the game than D did, and the D was better than year prior in some metrics.

[minnemike]

Yeah - his defense wasnt better than Mahomes. That's a tough way to go out. Maybe Purdy should have scored more against that KC D?

[mlhouse]

I think Shanahan is a good coach, but I think he gets by a lot on reputation. I watch a lot of JT OSullivan QB School and he is very critical of some of what Shanahan is doing such as spreading McCaffery out wide in the slot but lining him up 8 yards deep. There was a lot of questionable calls in the Super Bowl.

Part of it is that Shanahan has been in the league as a offensive coordinator or head coach for 16 years and I think he has some dated concepts in his offense. But then, he has had a top 5 offense in the NFLthe past two seasons with Mr. Irrelevant as the starting QB. Christian McCaffrey is a huge part of it as is Deebo, Kittle, and Aiyuk, solid players that can do a lot of things.

The WIlks thing looks like it might be more than just the Super Bowl loss. Their defense slipped in 2023 from Ryan's defense in 2022 which wsa the #1 defense in the NFL. If you look at the 20 games they played , I think its the 362 yards to Josh Dobbs and the Arizon Cardinals, the 452 yards given up to Minnesota in that loss, 436 yards in the Cardinal rematch, then giving up 356 yards to the Packers, 442 yards and 31 points to the Lions, and 455 yards to the Chiefs in the playoffs. I think that they did not feel Wilks' defenses were agressive enough for the talent.

[hategreenticemase]

I think Shanahan is a good coach, but I think he gets by a lot on reputation. I watch a lot of JT OSullivan QB School and he is very critical of some of what Shanahan is doing such as spreading McCaffery out wide in the slot but lining him up 8 yards deep. There was a lot of questionable calls in the Super Bowl.

Part of it is that Shanahan has been in the league as a offensive coordinator or head coach for 16 years and I think he has some dated concepts in his offense. But then, he has had a top 5 offense in the NFLthe past two seasons with Mr. Irrelevant as the starting QB. Christian McCaffrey is a huge part of it as is Deebo, Kittle, and Aiyuk, solid players that can do a lot of things.

The WIlks thing looks like it might be more than just the Super Bowl loss. Their defense slipped in 2023 from Ryan's defense in 2022 which wsa the #1 defense in the NFL. If you look at the 20 games they played , I think its the 362 yards to Josh Dobbs and the Arizon Cardinals, the 452 yards given up to Minnesota in that loss, 436 yards in the Cardinal rematch, then giving up 356 yards to the Packers, 442 yards and 31 points to the Lions, and 455 yards to the Chiefs in the playoffs. I think that they did not feel Wilks' defenses were agressive enough for the talent.

Stats I saw the PPG was better this year, but maybe that was wrong. Either way, wasnt some huge slipping. Baffling, and perhaps your other thoughts on Shanahan are correct. Seems over reactive and scapegoatish.

[mlhouse]

I think Shanahan is a good coach, but I think he gets by a lot on reputation. I watch a lot of JT OSullivan QB School and he is very critical of some of what Shanahan is doing such as spreading McCaffery out wide in the slot but lining him up 8 yards deep. There was a lot of questionable calls in the Super Bowl.

Part of it is that Shanahan has been in the league as a offensive coordinator or head coach for 16 years and I think he has some dated concepts in his offense. But then, he has had a top 5 offense in the NFLthe past two seasons with Mr. Irrelevant as the starting QB. Christian McCaffrey is a huge part of it as is Deebo, Kittle, and Aiyuk, solid players that can do a lot of things.

The WIlks thing looks like it might be more than just the Super Bowl loss. Their defense slipped in 2023 from Ryan's defense in 2022 which wsa the #1 defense in the NFL. If you look at the 20 games they played , I think its the 362 yards to Josh Dobbs and the Arizon Cardinals, the 452 yards given up to Minnesota in that loss, 436 yards in the Cardinal rematch, then giving up 356 yards to the Packers, 442 yards and 31 points to the Lions, and 455 yards to the Chiefs in the playoffs. I think that they did not feel Wilks' defenses were agressive enough for the talent.

Stats I saw the PPG was better this year, but maybe that was wrong. Either way, wasnt some huge slipping. Baffling, and perhaps your other thoughts on Shanahan are correct. Seems over reactive and scapegoatish.

Perhaps. But that is just the timing. It is my gut that they want to retain a coach on the staff or they want to hire some new thinking there.

[Mplsfonz]

Scapegoat?

[hategreenticemase]

Scapegoat?

Sure feels that way, which is just wrong imo.

[mlhouse]

Scapegoat?

Sure feels that way, which is just wrong imo.

Perhaps, but my guess is they had planned to make the move before the Super Bowl.

[rtb]

I read something that his preferred style of defense did not match what they previously ran and built their personnel for and there were issues adjusting to it most of the year, even though he tried to adjust to that scheme and players. in the end, they decided it just wasn't the right fit, not that he necessarily lost his job due to poor performance. idk that makes sense to me.

[weimy froob]

I read something that his preferred style of defense did not match what they previously ran and built their personnel for and there were issues adjusting to it most of the year, even though he tried to adjust to that scheme and players. in the end, they decided it just wasn't the right fit, not that he necessarily lost his job due to poor performance. idk that makes sense to me.

exactly. it wasn't the right fit. lots of talent on that defense and they underperformed relatively during the season. played a better game in the SB--but that doesn't take away from the other games and how the season went on that side of the ball for them. they weren't dominant.

[mlhouse]

I read something that his preferred style of defense did not match what they previously ran and built their personnel for and there were issues adjusting to it most of the year, even though he tried to adjust to that scheme and players. in the end, they decided it just wasn't the right fit, not that he necessarily lost his job due to poor performance. idk that makes sense to me.

exactly. it wasn't the right fit. lots of talent on that defense and they underperformed relatively during the season. played a better game in the SB--but that doesn't take away from the other games and how the season went on that side of the ball for them. they weren't dominant.

They gave up 455 yards in the Super Bowl. The worst defense in teh NFL gave up 389 yards/game. That wasn't a good game and when they needed to stop, they could not stop.

The one thing SHanahan is escaping criticism for is the boneheaded decision to receive the kickoff in overtime. The playoff OT rules make it just like college football OT in wanting to get the ball 2nd. That is on the head coach. Since KC had the ball 2nd in OT, they went for it on 4th and 1 from their own 34 yard line. If that is the first drive of OT, they probably are forced to punt.

[Da Gas Man's Ghost]

So he might be the scapegoat. So? Welcome to the world.

And his defense really struggled against Jordan Love and Goff. They were lucky to win those games. You can't judge it just by the last game.

Consider it this way: They lost to Kirk Cousins. If that's not a fireable offense, what is?

[weimy froob]

I read something that his preferred style of defense did not match what they previously ran and built their personnel for and there were issues adjusting to it most of the year, even though he tried to adjust to that scheme and players. in the end, they decided it just wasn't the right fit, not that he necessarily lost his job due to poor performance. idk that makes sense to me.

exactly. it wasn't the right fit. lots of talent on that defense and they underperformed relatively during the season. played a better game in the SB--but that doesn't take away from the other games and how the season went on that side of the ball for them. they weren't dominant.

They gave up 455 yards in the Super Bowl. The worst defense in teh NFL gave up 389 yards/game. That wasn't a good game and when they needed to stop, they could not stop.

The one thing SHanahan is escaping criticism for is the boneheaded decision to receive the kickoff in overtime. The playoff OT rules make it just like college football OT in wanting to get the ball 2nd. That is on the head coach. Since KC had the ball 2nd in OT, they went for it on 4th and 1 from their own 34 yard line. If that is the first drive of OT, they probably are forced to punt.

OT game. stats are skewed. they only gave up 19 points to the chiefs thru four quarters. that's a better game than they had against the packers or the lions. the defense underperformed during the season. it's a very reasonable decision that the 49ers made.

[hategreenticemase]

I think Shanahan is a good coach, but I think he gets by a lot on reputation. I watch a lot of JT OSullivan QB School and he is very critical of some of what Shanahan is doing such as spreading McCaffery out wide in the slot but lining him up 8 yards deep. There was a lot of questionable calls in the Super Bowl.

Part of it is that Shanahan has been in the league as a offensive coordinator or head coach for 16 years and I think he has some dated concepts in his offense. But then, he has had a top 5 offense in the NFLthe past two seasons with Mr. Irrelevant as the starting QB. Christian McCaffrey is a huge part of it as is Deebo, Kittle, and Aiyuk, solid players that can do a lot of things.

The WIlks thing looks like it might be more than just the Super Bowl loss. Their defense slipped in 2023 from Ryan's defense in 2022 which wsa the #1 defense in the NFL. If you look at the 20 games they played , I think its the 362 yards to Josh Dobbs and the Arizon Cardinals, the 452 yards given up to Minnesota in that loss, 436 yards in the Cardinal rematch, then giving up 356 yards to the Packers, 442 yards and 31 points to the Lions, and 455 yards to the Chiefs in the playoffs. I think that they did not feel Wilks' defenses were agressive enough for the talent.

Stats I saw the PPG was better this year, but maybe that was wrong. Either way, wasnt some huge slipping. Baffling, and perhaps your other thoughts on Shanahan are correct. Seems over reactive and scapegoatish.

Perhaps. But that is just the timing. It is my gut that they want to retain a coach on the staff or they want to hire some new thinking there.

This may be the correct answer.

[hategreenticemase]

I read something that his preferred style of defense did not match what they previously ran and built their personnel for and there were issues adjusting to it most of the year, even though he tried to adjust to that scheme and players. in the end, they decided it just wasn't the right fit, not that he necessarily lost his job due to poor performance. idk that makes sense to me.

exactly. it wasn't the right fit. lots of talent on that defense and they underperformed relatively during the season. played a better game in the SB--but that doesn't take away from the other games and how the season went on that side of the ball for them. they weren't dominant.

Underperformed? They were 3rd in NFL in points allowed.

As for this not right fit crap - ah, you hire a guy who will run a scheme different than the last two guys did, and then when he does that, and does relatively well - you fire him? I dont know, seems shitty to me. By all accounts he is a good guy and coach - he did well with Carolina interim wise.

He is sort of fucked now, not much left for jobs.

[weimy froob]

I read something that his preferred style of defense did not match what they previously ran and built their personnel for and there were issues adjusting to it most of the year, even though he tried to adjust to that scheme and players. in the end, they decided it just wasn't the right fit, not that he necessarily lost his job due to poor performance. idk that makes sense to me.

exactly. it wasn't the right fit. lots of talent on that defense and they underperformed relatively during the season. played a better game in the SB--but that doesn't take away from the other games and how the season went on that side of the ball for them. they weren't dominant.

Underperformed? They were 3rd in NFL in points allowed.

As for this not right fit crap - ah, you hire a guy who will run a scheme different than the last two guys did, and then when he does that, and does relatively well - you fire him? I dont know, seems shitty to me. By all accounts he is a good guy and coach - he did well with Carolina interim wise.

He is sort of fucked now, not much left for jobs.

what part of relatively do you need explained? that defense was not anywhere as good as it was the year before. that's all the justification the 49ers needed for firing him.

[hategreenticemase]

exactly. it wasn't the right fit. lots of talent on that defense and they underperformed relatively during the season. played a better game in the SB--but that doesn't take away from the other games and how the season went on that side of the ball for them. they weren't dominant.

Underperformed? They were 3rd in NFL in points allowed.

As for this not right fit crap - ah, you hire a guy who will run a scheme different than the last two guys did, and then when he does that, and does relatively well - you fire him? I dont know, seems shitty to me. By all accounts he is a good guy and coach - he did well with Carolina interim wise.

He is sort of fucked now, not much left for jobs.

what part of relatively do you need explained? that defense was not anywhere as good as it was the year before. that's all the justification the 49ers needed for firing him.

[salamander]

I don't get it. Purdy was the reason they lost the game.

I'd also say the defense gave the offense a chance to go up really big early in the game but the offense pissed it away. Mahomes had a sub 100 QB Rating which is better than what the Ravens or Bills did against him.

Defense in the first half:
3 & out
4 & out
gave up big play and then forced/recovered a fumble
3 & out
FG

Then they started the 2nd half:
3 plays and an INT
3 & out
FG
3 & out

The defense was playing absolutely lights out at that point and they were only winning by 4 points after all this. If I'm the defense, I'm fucking pissed off the offense doesn't have a 2-3 possession lead at this point in the game.

[salamander]

I read something that his preferred style of defense did not match what they previously ran and built their personnel for and there were issues adjusting to it most of the year, even though he tried to adjust to that scheme and players. in the end, they decided it just wasn't the right fit, not that he necessarily lost his job due to poor performance. idk that makes sense to me.

If this is true that's a knock on whoever hired him.

[Da Gas Man's Ghost]

I don't get it. Purdy was the reason they lost the game.

I'd also say the defense gave the offense a chance to go up really big early in the game but the offense pissed it away. Mahomes had a sub 100 QB Rating which is better than what the Ravens or Bills did against him.

How about the two games before the SB?

[salamander]

I don't get it. Purdy was the reason they lost the game.

I'd also say the defense gave the offense a chance to go up really big early in the game but the offense pissed it away. Mahomes had a sub 100 QB Rating which is better than what the Ravens or Bills did against him.

How about the two games before the SB?

Didn't watch much of the playoffs other than the SB so I definitely could've missed some reasons. Just don't think the defense lost the 49ers the SB.

[Da Gas Man's Ghost]

I don't get it. Purdy was the reason they lost the game.

I'd also say the defense gave the offense a chance to go up really big early in the game but the offense pissed it away. Mahomes had a sub 100 QB Rating which is better than what the Ravens or Bills did against him.

How about the two games before the SB?

Didn't watch much of the playoffs other than the SB so I definitely could've missed some reasons. Just don't think the defense lost the 49ers the SB.

I'll agree with your evaluation of the SB defense. They held Mahomes to 19 in regulation even with the 49ers putting the ball on the carpet. That's good in any metric.

[weimy froob]

he didn't get fired because of the SB game--even though mlhouse wasn't impressed with their performance against the chiefs. the defense took a step back this year in their eyes (mine too) and they didn't think the main reason why was because of their personnel.