Latest Mock Penix to Minnesota!!!!!

[hategreenticemase]

I was pretty big on Penix all season but I’ve started to waiver a bit.

I sure don’t want him at #11 but if I could get him in rd #2 and draft a stud on D with #11… I would take that over taking JJ at #11.

Welcome back Ol' Friend

Second! I told the kids he was close to being back!

[hategreenticemase]

I was pretty big on Penix all season but I’ve started to waiver a bit.

I sure don’t want him at #11 but if I could get him in rd #2 and draft a stud on D with #11… I would take that over taking JJ at #11.

I am the same on most of this, but could live with JJ at 11 (but wouldnt feel great about it). Your plan on D stud at 11 and Penix in 2nd is not bad either, however, does he rise now after the combine? I dont know.

[RubeTube]

I was pretty big on Penix all season but I’ve started to waiver a bit.

I sure don’t want him at #11 but if I could get him in rd #2 and draft a stud on D with #11… I would take that over taking JJ at #11.

Is the championship game the reason you’ve started to waiver?

No.

I just think he has issues that need to be cleaned up. His age and injury history is concerning to me also.

I still wouldn’t mind him though and I don’t think he’s far behind if at all to JJ.

[Butch Bradford]

I was pretty big on Penix all season but I’ve started to waiver a bit.

I sure don’t want him at #11 but if I could get him in rd #2 and draft a stud on D with #11… I would take that over taking JJ at #11.

I am the same on most of this, but could live with JJ at 11 (but wouldnt feel great about it). Your plan on D stud at 11 and Penix in 2nd is not bad either, however, does he rise now after the combine? I dont know.

I'd be ecstatic if JJ McCarthy dropped to us at 11, but I honestly don't see that happening.

[R403]

Penix is a household name among college football fans after leading the Huskies to the College Football Playoff national championship game.

And it wasn't just through the interviews, as B/R's NFL Scouting Department called him "comfortably the best quarterback during throwing drills by of substantial margin, no one knows even close to him”

"Penix nailed most of the routes he threw," the evaluation read. "Short or deep, inside or outside, it didn't really matter; Penix put it on his man, was head shoulders above the competition at the combine.”

[witljon]

True, but I am an informed amateur who actually reviews the data. Most of the opinions expressed by others in this forum on prospects are just regurgitated hearsay. I've been pretty fucking accurate on most of my calls regarding players in the NFL draft.

WIth Penix the mechanical throwing problems are pretty obvious. I stay a mile away from him because I don't think they are fully correctable. If he was mobile and tough, like Philip Rivers, I might think he is a top 10 pick. But he ain't. WHen Michigan put even slight pressure on him he struggled and then they hit him and he acted injured the rest of the game.

Gotta love the clowns that think they’re the smartest guy in the room.

LIke your clownish opinion? Is there anything you actually dispute in the statements I made? Or are you just being petty? I think its the latter.

I definitely dispute your opinion is any better than the opinions expressed by others.

[RubeTube]

I was pretty big on Penix all season but I’ve started to waiver a bit.

I sure don’t want him at #11 but if I could get him in rd #2 and draft a stud on D with #11… I would take that over taking JJ at #11.

I am the same on most of this, but could live with JJ at 11 (but wouldnt feel great about it). Your plan on D stud at 11 and Penix in 2nd is not bad either, however, does he rise now after the combine? I dont know.

I'd be ecstatic if JJ McCarthy dropped to us at 11, but I honestly don't see that happening.

I’m fine with him at #11 but I’m not trading up for him at all. I wouldn’t be ecstatic but I would be cautiously optimistic. I just think he’s being WAY overrated and people are going off his potential rather than anything we’ve actually seen him do. Sometimes that works out though.

[mlhouse]

Gotta love the clowns that think they’re the smartest guy in the room.

LIke your clownish opinion? Is there anything you actually dispute in the statements I made? Or are you just being petty? I think its the latter.

I definitely dispute your opinion is any better than the opinions expressed by others.

But I never really stated it was better. Just based on actual analysis rather than reprinting what is on the internet.

By definition, everyone things their opinion is better than others.

[mlhouse]

people are going off his potential rather than anything we’ve actually seen him do

This is true of EVERY QB prospect in this and every draft.

[RubeTube]

people are going off his potential rather than anything we’ve actually seen him do

This is true of EVERY QB prospect in this and every draft.

True but we’ve seen the other guys actually play big time in college. We haven’t really seen JJ do anything but be a game manager.

[mlhouse]

people are going off his potential rather than anything we’ve actually seen him do

This is true of EVERY QB prospect in this and every draft.

True but we’ve seen the other guys actually play big time in college. We haven’t really seen JJ do anything but be a game manager.

If that is what you want to believe. You are not looking at the throws he makes and the style of QB he plays. What really sets McCarthy up over other QBs is his ability int he play action. Play action is a very difficult style of play for young QBs because you take your eyes away from the LOS. That is why so many teams run RPO, the QB never takes his eyes off the defense. But McCarthy is very good at the play action passes.

There are some minor issues with McCarthy, but he has by far the best arm talent in this draft and he has above average mobility. For the NFL throws into NFL windows, McCarthy is a very solid QB prospect. IF you want to throw the quick out from the far hash like some college plays are designed, you will not be a NFL coach for long so some of the criticism of McCarthy's outside throwing are ridiculous, although he can improve all of his throws by getting his feet lined up in the right direction quicker.

[D_H]

This is true of EVERY QB prospect in this and every draft.

True but we’ve seen the other guys actually play big time in college. We haven’t really seen JJ do anything but be a game manager.

If that is what you want to believe. You are not looking at the throws he makes and the style of QB he plays. What really sets McCarthy up over other QBs is his ability int he play action. Play action is a very difficult style of play for young QBs because you take your eyes away from the LOS. That is why so many teams run RPO, the QB never takes his eyes off the defense. But McCarthy is very good at the play action passes.

There are some minor issues with McCarthy, but he has by far the best arm talent in this draft and he has above average mobility. For the NFL throws into NFL windows, McCarthy is a very solid QB prospect. IF you want to throw the quick out from the far hash like some college plays are designed, you will not be a NFL coach for long so some of the criticism of McCarthy's outside throwing are ridiculous, although he can improve all of his throws by getting his feet lined up in the right direction quicker.

Best arm talent in the draft? That's laughable dude.


Scout take at the combine



On tape, against TCU, he's shown a glaring deficiency in throws to the boundary on the right side, hinting at a potential mechanical flaw in his release or footwork.

His dropbacks sometimes lack the crispness and rhythm, causing him to telegraph throws, especially on out routes, giving corners a jump on the ball.

Physique-wise, he sports a wiry frame that might raise eyebrows about his ability to take NFL-caliber hits, especially between the tackles or on scrambles.

His pocket presence needs refinement; while he’s got the wheels to extend plays, he tends to bail from clean pockets rather than stepping up and navigating the pocket with poise.

His football IQ, while promising, showcases a rawness in reading complex defensive schemes and disguises, a red flag when projecting against NFL defenses.

He screams back up

[witljon]

LIke your clownish opinion? Is there anything you actually dispute in the statements I made? Or are you just being petty? I think its the latter.

I definitely dispute your opinion is any better than the opinions expressed by others.

But I never really stated it was better. Just based on actual analysis rather than reprinting what is on the internet.

By definition, everyone things their opinion is better than others.

I’m still basing my opinion on games I’ve watched, while kinda hoping to be convinced JJ McCarthy can be more than a game manager, especially if the Vikings draft him. I’m gun shy of McCarthy and Jayden Daniels. Are they boom or bust?

[mlhouse]

I definitely dispute your opinion is any better than the opinions expressed by others.

But I never really stated it was better. Just based on actual analysis rather than reprinting what is on the internet.

By definition, everyone things their opinion is better than others.

I’m still basing my opinion on games I’ve watched, while kinda hoping to be convinced JJ McCarthy can be more than a game manager, especially if the Vikings draft him. I’m gun shy of McCarthy and Jayden Daniels. Are they boom or bust?

They are all boom or bust, including Caleb WIlliams. What you have to evaluate is whether they have the play ability to become a franchise NFL QB. To evaluate you look at the throws and plays they make, not the game. All of this evaluation is made with degrees of uncertainty, especially since the NCAA plays with significantly different rules that does not transfer 1-1 to the NFL.

Of the 4 top QBs in the draft, at least in my book (Williams, Daniels, McCarthy, Maye) I think Maye has the biggest bust potential of them all. He has the size and arm, plus adequate mobility, but he is inconsistent. The inconsistency is caused by very poor footwork. That can perhaps be corrected, but it needs to be corrected to be successful in the NFL.

I think with McCarthy you are evaluating the game stats, rather than the throws he makes. It could be argued that some of the statistical performance that McCarthy generates is part of the running game of the Wolverines, but some of that is running the play action incredibly well on McCarthy's part. Plus, as I have mentioned in other posts, the Michigan oLine is very overrated, at least in terms of pass pro. In fact, they were not a real strong unit especially at tackle as pass blockers. 

[witljon]

But I never really stated it was better. Just based on actual analysis rather than reprinting what is on the internet.

By definition, everyone things their opinion is better than others.

I’m still basing my opinion on games I’ve watched, while kinda hoping to be convinced JJ McCarthy can be more than a game manager, especially if the Vikings draft him. I’m gun shy of McCarthy and Jayden Daniels. Are they boom or bust?

They are all boom or bust, including Caleb WIlliams. What you have to evaluate is whether they have the play ability to become a franchise NFL QB. To evaluate you look at the throws and plays they make, not the game. All of this evaluation is made with degrees of uncertainty, especially since the NCAA plays with significantly different rules that does not transfer 1-1 to the NFL.

Of the 4 top QBs in the draft, at least in my book (Williams, Daniels, McCarthy, Maye) I think Maye has the biggest bust potential of them all. He has the size and arm, plus adequate mobility, but he is inconsistent. The inconsistency is caused by very poor footwork. That can perhaps be corrected, but it needs to be corrected to be successful in the NFL.

I think with McCarthy you are evaluating the game stats, rather than the throws he makes. It could be argued that some of the statistical performance that McCarthy generates is part of the running game of the Wolverines, but some of that is running the play action incredibly well on McCarthy's part. Plus, as I have mentioned in other posts, the Michigan oLine is very overrated, at least in terms of pass pro. In fact, they were not a real strong unit especially at tackle as pass blockers. 

You say Maye is inconsistent. What about Daniels? I only seen him against Alabama. He was much more of a good runner than passer in that game.

[Hector]

I’m still basing my opinion on games I’ve watched, while kinda hoping to be convinced JJ McCarthy can be more than a game manager, especially if the Vikings draft him. I’m gun shy of McCarthy and Jayden Daniels. Are they boom or bust?

They are all boom or bust, including Caleb WIlliams. What you have to evaluate is whether they have the play ability to become a franchise NFL QB. To evaluate you look at the throws and plays they make, not the game. All of this evaluation is made with degrees of uncertainty, especially since the NCAA plays with significantly different rules that does not transfer 1-1 to the NFL.

Of the 4 top QBs in the draft, at least in my book (Williams, Daniels, McCarthy, Maye) I think Maye has the biggest bust potential of them all. He has the size and arm, plus adequate mobility, but he is inconsistent. The inconsistency is caused by very poor footwork. That can perhaps be corrected, but it needs to be corrected to be successful in the NFL.

I think with McCarthy you are evaluating the game stats, rather than the throws he makes. It could be argued that some of the statistical performance that McCarthy generates is part of the running game of the Wolverines, but some of that is running the play action incredibly well on McCarthy's part. Plus, as I have mentioned in other posts, the Michigan oLine is very overrated, at least in terms of pass pro. In fact, they were not a real strong unit especially at tackle as pass blockers. 

You say Maye is inconsistent. What about Daniels? I only seen him against Alabama. He was much more of a good runner than passer in that game.

I agree DH. Daniels throws a pretty deep ball, but looks a little too one read and run from what I've seen.

[mlhouse]

inconsistent. What about Daniels? I only seen him against Alabama. He was much more of a good runner than passer in that game.

Daniels has elite movement skills. IF you want a QB comp of Lamar Jackson with the full upside of Lamar, this is your pick. He is a legitimate threat to be a 1000+ yard runner in the NFL.

Same with Williams comp of Patrick Mahomes. He has elite playmaking ability.

That is what puts them in Tier 1 (WIlliams) and Tier 2 (Daniels) over Tier 3 (McCarthy and Maye) in this draft. Tier 4 is (Penix, Nix, and Rattler).

Tier 1 should be the top pick in the draft. Tier 2 should be the 2nd. Teir 3 can be picks 3 -13 depending on what else happens.

TIer 4 are complete wild cards. I think they should be late 2nd round picks at best, but some teams might move even to late in the first round to take them.

[witljon]

inconsistent. What about Daniels? I only seen him against Alabama. He was much more of a good runner than passer in that game.

Daniels has elite movement skills. IF you want a QB comp of Lamar Jackson with the full upside of Lamar, this is your pick. He is a legitimate threat to be a 1000+ yard runner in the NFL.

Same with Williams comp of Patrick Mahomes. He has elite playmaking ability.

That is what puts them in Tier 1 (WIlliams) and Tier 2 (Daniels) over Tier 3 (McCarthy and Maye) in this draft. Tier 4 is (Penix, Nix, and Rattler).

Tier 1 should be the top pick in the draft. Tier 2 should be the 2nd. Teir 3 can be picks 3 -13 depending on what else happens.

TIer 4 are complete wild cards. I think they should be late 2nd round picks at best, but some teams might move even to late in the first round to take them.

Do you feel Daniels is a more consistent passer than Maye?

[D_H]

The best fit for Michael Penix Jr. in the 2024 NFL Draft is with the Minnesota Vikings.

While the full roster might not be as ready to win now as the Steelers or as young and promising as the Seahawks, the Vikings have one thing that no one else has: Justin Jefferson.

Jefferson is in the midst of contract extension negotiations, and one thing that may be holding it up is the lack of a quarterback. Kirk Cousins is 35, coming off an Achilles tear, and an unrestricted free agent. And as for Plan B? There is no Plan B.

Move up and get the best arm talent in the draft!!!!!

[Tuck ya in]

Why? His medicals came back clean at the combine.

What do you know that the combine doctors who examined him don’t?

He's implying that he's already had two ACL injuries on the same knee, not that he's checked out fine as of today. Lending credence to potentially being an injury risk going forward.

I know. But the doctors said he was clean. It’s the height of rube arrogance to disagree with doctors who actually examined the patient from your couch or basement.

Do you think they don’t check for health concerns that could be an issue moving forward?

I know. I think most players who've had injuries are eventually cleared by a medical staff, but you still have to factor in in to the analysis of a player. Specifically with 2 serious knee injuries, and when investing in a Qb high in the draft.

Some bodies just break down more than others, for whatever reason. Maybe his will continue to have issues, maybe not. But that's one of the main reasons he may slide in the draft. He does have a great arm though.

[Beef Supreme]

He's implying that he's already had two ACL injuries on the same knee, not that he's checked out fine as of today. Lending credence to potentially being an injury risk going forward.

I know. But the doctors said he was clean. It’s the height of rube arrogance to disagree with doctors who actually examined the patient from your couch or basement.

Do you think they don’t check for health concerns that could be an issue moving forward?

I know. I think most players who've had injuries are eventually cleared by a medical staff, but you still have to factor in in to the analysis of a player. Specifically with 2 serious knee injuries, and when investing in a Qb high in the draft.

Some bodies just break down more than others, for whatever reason. Maybe his will continue to have issues, maybe not. But that's one of the main reasons he may slide in the draft. He does have a great arm though.

He had two full college seasons on that knee with no problems. The knee has been demonstrated to be healthy on the field and doctors have checked it out and cleared it.

That's good enough for me. I'm not going to sit on my computer and argue against doctors who've examined the patient.

[Tuck ya in]

I know. But the doctors said he was clean. It’s the height of rube arrogance to disagree with doctors who actually examined the patient from your couch or basement.

Do you think they don’t check for health concerns that could be an issue moving forward?

I know. I think most players who've had injuries are eventually cleared by a medical staff, but you still have to factor in in to the analysis of a player. Specifically with 2 serious knee injuries, and when investing in a Qb high in the draft.

Some bodies just break down more than others, for whatever reason. Maybe his will continue to have issues, maybe not. But that's one of the main reasons he may slide in the draft. He does have a great arm though.

He had two full college seasons on that knee with no problems. The knee has been demonstrated to be healthy on the field and doctors have checked it out and cleared it.

That's good enough for me. I'm not going to sit on my computer and argue against doctors who've examined the patient.

Are you in the medical field by chance? I had to go back at look at Weimys' comment. You're basing your take mostly off of his "take him off the board" comment I'm assuming? Because what I'm saying is a different point entirely from him being medically cleared now, and he's still on my board.....albeit the late 1st round early 2nd arena.

[Señor Trumpo]

JFC! Look at his hands! He can get both of them around an NFL football with ease.

[Beef Supreme]

I know. I think most players who've had injuries are eventually cleared by a medical staff, but you still have to factor in in to the analysis of a player. Specifically with 2 serious knee injuries, and when investing in a Qb high in the draft.

Some bodies just break down more than others, for whatever reason. Maybe his will continue to have issues, maybe not. But that's one of the main reasons he may slide in the draft. He does have a great arm though.

He had two full college seasons on that knee with no problems. The knee has been demonstrated to be healthy on the field and doctors have checked it out and cleared it.

That's good enough for me. I'm not going to sit on my computer and argue against doctors who've examined the patient.

Are you in the medical field by chance? I had to go back at look at Weimys' comment. You're basing your take mostly off of his "take him off the board" comment I'm assuming? Because what I'm saying is a different point entirely from him being medically cleared now, and he's still on my board.....albeit the late 1st round early 2nd arena.

No I am not. Not physical medicine anyway.

Yes, Weimy’s take him off the board comment started this debate. He’s obviously entitled to his opinion, but if you say you’re taking him off your board after the doctors clear him, it means he was never on your board and you don’t care about a professional medical opinion after an evaluation specifically into the areas of concern. Just say that.


As far as dinging him a little? I mean, I don’t know you you speculate into that. He had injuries. He’s been cleared. How do you say how much that dings him? What kind of percentage are we able to put on the chance, not supported by the medical opinion, of reinjury? It’s just a shot in the dark. Go ahead and take it, we’re just Froobs shooting the shit after all, but it’s just a guess with no support. I’m going with the doctors. If they cleared him, they cleared him. If they’re wrong, they’re wrong. But at least it’s an expert opinion based on examination and not a “gut feel” or whatever else Froobs are basing this on.

[Beef Supreme]

JFC! Look at his hands! He can get both of them around an NFL football with ease.

The anti-Daunte.

[weimy froob]

He had two full college seasons on that knee with no problems. The knee has been demonstrated to be healthy on the field and doctors have checked it out and cleared it.

That's good enough for me. I'm not going to sit on my computer and argue against doctors who've examined the patient.

Are you in the medical field by chance? I had to go back at look at Weimys' comment. You're basing your take mostly off of his "take him off the board" comment I'm assuming? Because what I'm saying is a different point entirely from him being medically cleared now, and he's still on my board.....albeit the late 1st round early 2nd arena.

No I am not. Not physical medicine anyway.

Yes, Weimy’s take him off the board comment started this debate. He’s obviously entitled to his opinion, but if you say you’re taking him off your board after the doctors clear him, it means he was never on your board and you don’t care about a professional medical opinion after an evaluation specifically into the areas of concern. Just say that.


As far as dinging him a little? I mean, I don’t know you you speculate into that. He had injuries. He’s been cleared. How do you say how much that dings him? What kind of percentage are we able to put on the chance, not supported by the medical opinion, of reinjury? It’s just a shot in the dark. Go ahead and take it, we’re just Froobs shooting the shit after all, but it’s just a guess with no support. I’m going with the doctors. If they cleared him, they cleared him. If they’re wrong, they’re wrong. But at least it’s an expert opinion based on examination and not a “gut feel” or whatever else Froobs are basing this on.

i'm basing my decision on injury history and risk/reward based on a pick for QB at 11 or earlier. this is all on the vikings taking the plunge and picking a QB in the first round. if they don't and he's around in the second round i think the risk/reward would be different, but if it's a first round pick i'd take nix over him if the other four were gone. i always said that his injury history was a red flag with me--i just clarified that i wouldn't take him because of that. rightly or wrongly, that scared me off. too big of a move to have that uncertainty for me with the other options out there. that's all.

this is from an article i posted yesterday in the todd mcshay thread. it looks like teams are going to do their own due diligence on him with further medical exams.

Penix and Nix further complicate things. While both are 24 years old after winding college careers, their on-field and combine play has left enough teams intrigued.

Penix must still make it through medical exams and concerns from an injury-plagued college career at Washington and Indiana, but his performance at the combine mimicked his huge season in leading the Huskies to the national championship game. To many, he had the best throwing performance of the group. He looks pro ready.

[weimy froob]

edit: i should have added this. it was under a youtube vid and i just looked at it again.

If his knee checks out, he’s a likely first-round pick — offering another cheaper option than trying to deal for Fields.

It’s the same with Nix. His arm may lack the pop of the elite draft prospects but his accuracy Saturday showed that his FBS-record 77.45 percent completion percentage last season wasn't merely the product of the Oregon offensive system. His footwork was also vastly improved and no one is questioning his football acumen or leadership.

[cunningham]

edit: i should have added this. it was under a youtube vid and i just looked at it again.

If his knee checks out, he’s a likely first-round pick — offering another cheaper option than trying to deal for Fields.

It’s the same with Nix. His arm may lack the pop of the elite draft prospects but his accuracy Saturday showed that his FBS-record 77.45 percent completion percentage last season wasn't merely the product of the Oregon offensive system. His footwork was also vastly improved and no one is questioning his football acumen or leadership.

Isn't Penix around 65% completion rate? Nix has way better stats, but both could pull a Bridgewater on us. McCarthy seems safer because he is young and worth trading up a few spots for if the price tag isn't too high. Maybe someone lets us do a trade with them like KOA did when he got Cine? You know, fleece someone...

I like that Penix had a better record and played in the championship. His completion rate scares me a bit though. Nix is higher, but physically seems a bigger risk. JJ is younger and may have a lot of room to grow.

JJ to JJ would be cool to call out all the time too. J to J...

[Señor Trumpo]

edit: i should have added this. it was under a youtube vid and i just looked at it again.

If his knee checks out, he’s a likely first-round pick — offering another cheaper option than trying to deal for Fields.

It’s the same with Nix. His arm may lack the pop of the elite draft prospects but his accuracy Saturday showed that his FBS-record 77.45 percent completion percentage last season wasn't merely the product of the Oregon offensive system. His footwork was also vastly improved and no one is questioning his football acumen or leadership.

Isn't Penix around 65% completion rate? Nix has way better stats, but both could pull a Bridgewater on us. McCarthy seems safer because he is young and worth trading up a few spots for if the price tag isn't too high. Maybe someone lets us do a trade with them like KOA did when he got Cine? You know, fleece someone...

I like that Penix had a better record and played in the championship. His completion rate scares me a bit though. Nix is higher, but physically seems a bigger risk. JJ is younger and may have a lot of room to grow.

JJ to JJ would be cool to call out all the time too. J to J...

Nix is the only QB that the Vikings didn't interview of the top 6 at the Combine. I think they are out on him.

[cunningham]

edit: i should have added this. it was under a youtube vid and i just looked at it again.

If his knee checks out, he’s a likely first-round pick — offering another cheaper option than trying to deal for Fields.

It’s the same with Nix. His arm may lack the pop of the elite draft prospects but his accuracy Saturday showed that his FBS-record 77.45 percent completion percentage last season wasn't merely the product of the Oregon offensive system. His footwork was also vastly improved and no one is questioning his football acumen or leadership.

Isn't Penix around 65% completion rate? Nix has way better stats, but both could pull a Bridgewater on us. McCarthy seems safer because he is young and worth trading up a few spots for if the price tag isn't too high. Maybe someone lets us do a trade with them like KOA did when he got Cine? You know, fleece someone...

I like that Penix had a better record and played in the championship. His completion rate scares me a bit though. Nix is higher, but physically seems a bigger risk. JJ is younger and may have a lot of room to grow.

JJ to JJ would be cool to call out all the time too. J to J...

Nix is the only QB that the Vikings didn't interview of the top 6 at the Combine. I think they are out on him.

Good to know. I say they take JJ if they are gonna sit near 11. Sucks we can't ever get one of the top ones. Of course the year we need a quarterback is the year there are a bunch, but a ton of teams need one.

Who were the 6? I get the top 3, JJ, and Penix, but there is another?