Monday Night Wars

[cmd24]

I'm in the middle of a rewatch of the Nitro/Thunder vs. Raw episodes. I started at the Bash at the Beach Hogan turn in 1996. I've gone thru each episode since then, and am currently at the end of May in 1998. It's no wonder why WCW kicked but for a stretch there. The production value of WWE was pretty poor, until around the time that Stone Cold started getting a big push. I'm planning on watching it until at least the buyout in 2001. I have to say, it's been kind of cool to rewatch some of these storylines. Takes me back to my college years. It's cool watching the buildup of guys like Goldberg, the DX story, The Rock (from his days as Rocky, thru the NOD).

[Coby]

These are great storylines fam.

[RubeTube]

I really liked WCW in this timeframe.

[cmd24]

I really liked WCW in this timeframe.

I did too. It was the first time that I had time to watch this stuff, and the interest. The early days of Raw came on when I was in high school, so I missed it due to sports, and such. Fall of my freshman year of college was right around the start of the NWO, so it was an easy draw for me. Plus I had evenings free. I think it was the middle of 98 when I finally started watching WCW and WWF at the same time. Some pretty damn good storylines in that era. I’ve fallen out of favor of watching wrestling now, but I do find myself enamored by the backstage stuff, and the process in general.

[j2j]

WCW and the NWO was the shit back in college. Loved it. Must see TV for our dorm/house.

[cmd24]

I'm in to August of '98...the Warrior just showed up on WCW. My God, was that guy horrible on the mic.

[j2j]

I'm in to August of '98...the Warrior just showed up on WCW. My God, was that guy horrible on the mic.

I've long thought that WCW nailed the initial start of the NWO, but soon the idea of what they were doing was much better than the actuality of what they were doing. The idea of Warrior was much better than the reality.

[cmd24]

I'm in to August of '98...the Warrior just showed up on WCW. My God, was that guy horrible on the mic.

I've long thought that WCW nailed the initial start of the NWO, but soon the idea of what they were doing was much better than the actuality of what they were doing. The idea of Warrior was much better than the reality.

It's funny...when I started this, I couldn't believe what a poor product the WWE had at that time (summer of '96) in comparison to the WCW. Two years in, they've done a complete shift. I'm finding myself bored with the WCW stories, and even the mic skills of these guys. During this stretch, back then, I watched both companies religiously. Around the time of the Hogan/Nash finger flop match, I tuned out of WCW. I'm starting to remember why. They ran their course, and the build-up of Stone Cold, The Rock, HHH, along with 'Taker, is too much. But, I'm going to stick it out until the purchase in March of 2001. I want to see how bad it got.

I'm also watching the actual Monday Night Wars 20-episode series. That is a fantastic documentary, for those that followed wrestling during that era. I've been very happy with the programming options that are on the WWE Network, as a whole.

[j2j]

I watched the Monday Night Wars series before WWE Network stopped working on PS3. I could always put it on my phone and cast it, but I'm bitter.

[j2j]

[cmd24]

Not saying that this storyline has anything directly to do with the downfall of WCW, but my God was the Raven storyline stupid. I'm in to early September of 1998, and it gets more tiresome with each show.

[j2j]

Not saying that this storyline has anything directly to do with the downfall of WCW, but my God was the Raven storyline stupid. I'm in to early September of 1998, and it gets more tiresome with each show.

Which one was that?

Raven had great potential, but only ECW had a clue how to use him.

[cmd24]

Not saying that this storyline has anything directly to do with the downfall of WCW, but my God was the Raven storyline stupid. I'm in to early September of 1998, and it gets more tiresome with each show.

Which one was that?

Raven had great potential, but only ECW had a clue how to use him.

Right now, they're leading up to Fall Brawl/War Games where Raven and Saturn are going to meet. If Saturn wins, the entire Flock is free. If Raven wins, Saturn has to rejoin. It feels like it's just annoying, at this point. Maybe that's more of an indication of the writing going downhill at WCW at this point. If memory serves, I believe WWE has regained the ratings lead for good.

One thing I'm finding more and more surprising, that I never really paid attention to back then, is that the mic skills seem to be so much better in the WWE. A lot of the WCW stuff seems like they're trying too hard to act out something, rather than just going with it. Or, maybe it's because Stone Cold and the Rock are just SO FREAKING GOOD, that it makes everything else seem on a lower level.

Plus, King and JR are better at calling the matches. I really like Heanan's commentary, for the humor, but the other guys seem more rehearsed, where King and JR sound like they're just going with it. And King is awesomely funny.

[j2j]

Not saying that this storyline has anything directly to do with the downfall of WCW, but my God was the Raven storyline stupid. I'm in to early September of 1998, and it gets more tiresome with each show.

Which one was that?

Raven had great potential, but only ECW had a clue how to use him.

Right now, they're leading up to Fall Brawl/War Games where Raven and Saturn are going to meet. If Saturn wins, the entire Flock is free. If Raven wins, Saturn has to rejoin. It feels like it's just annoying, at this point. Maybe that's more of an indication of the writing going downhill at WCW at this point. If memory serves, I believe WWE has regained the ratings lead for good.

One thing I'm finding more and more surprising, that I never really paid attention to back then, is that the mic skills seem to be so much better in the WWE. A lot of the WCW stuff seems like they're trying too hard to act out something, rather than just going with it. Or, maybe it's because Stone Cold and the Rock are just SO FREAKING GOOD, that it makes everything else seem on a lower level.

Plus, King and JR are better at calling the matches. I really like Heanan's commentary, for the humor, but the other guys seem more rehearsed, where King and JR sound like they're just going with it. And King is awesomely funny.

WCW definitely gets overrated as time goes by. I loved it at the time, and watches both programs, but going back, WCW was brutally bad for most of it.

I watched a bunch of the Rock vs Austin promos and matches the last couple days. They really were on a whole nother level when it came to working the crowd.

[cmd24]

Which one was that?

Raven had great potential, but only ECW had a clue how to use him.

Right now, they're leading up to Fall Brawl/War Games where Raven and Saturn are going to meet. If Saturn wins, the entire Flock is free. If Raven wins, Saturn has to rejoin. It feels like it's just annoying, at this point. Maybe that's more of an indication of the writing going downhill at WCW at this point. If memory serves, I believe WWE has regained the ratings lead for good.

One thing I'm finding more and more surprising, that I never really paid attention to back then, is that the mic skills seem to be so much better in the WWE. A lot of the WCW stuff seems like they're trying too hard to act out something, rather than just going with it. Or, maybe it's because Stone Cold and the Rock are just SO FREAKING GOOD, that it makes everything else seem on a lower level.

Plus, King and JR are better at calling the matches. I really like Heanan's commentary, for the humor, but the other guys seem more rehearsed, where King and JR sound like they're just going with it. And King is awesomely funny.

WCW definitely gets overrated as time goes by. I loved it at the time, and watches both programs, but going back, WCW was brutally bad for most of it.

I watched a bunch of the Rock vs Austin promos and matches the last couple days. They really were on a whole nother level when it came to working the crowd.

I was more of a WCW guy, at least until late 98, but watched both, as well. I never saw WCW being this bad, but now watching it back thru, it's glaringly obvious.

I've never been a Bret Hart fan, but boy did WCW screw up his character, too.

[j2j]

I was a HUGE Bret Hart fan, so it pissed me off at the time.

[Tony Bongwater]

Just to fuck around. Heres thd "Baywatch" episode leading up to bash at the beach 95. Commentary by a few people.

https://youtu.be/u6FJ2gNLcUg

[cmd24]

For some reason, the WWE Network doesn't have Halloween Havoc '98. Warrior vs. Hogan. I think I've become too cynical about WCW storylines, because I'm HATING this Warrior/Hogan angle. It seems that Warrior left fairly quietly after this, or Starrcade.

Another point of note...DDP is horseshit on the mic. Good worker, maybe over sells, at times, but who the fuck was writing for him? Terrible.

[j2j]

For some reason, the WWE Network doesn't have Halloween Havoc '98. Warrior vs. Hogan. I think I've become too cynical about WCW storylines, because I'm HATING this Warrior/Hogan angle. It seems that Warrior left fairly quietly after this, or Starrcade.

Another point of note...DDP is horseshit on the mic. Good worker, maybe over sells, at times, but who the fuck was writing for him? Terrible.

That whole storyline was to feed Hogan's ego. It was so incredibly bad, when really you'd think it would have potential, but the writers were bad, Hogan needed to get over, and Warrior was mentally gone by then.

[cmd24]

I took a break from the Wars, but I'm back now. Flair just won the belt on a quick count, in the cage at Unsensored 99. As I may have said in earlier post, I quit watching, orginally, after the "Finger Poke from Hell." I'm curious to see how the NWO breaks up in the upcoming weeks, since I didn't see it before. Must be unraveling, because Scott Steiner just beat the piss out of Buff Bagwell.

Also, another observation...Chris Jericho is freaking great on the mic.

[KevinBaconIsNotMyHero]

For some reason, the WWE Network doesn't have Halloween Havoc '98. Warrior vs. Hogan. I think I've become too cynical about WCW storylines, because I'm HATING this Warrior/Hogan angle. It seems that Warrior left fairly quietly after this, or Starrcade.

Another point of note...DDP is horseshit on the mic. Good worker, maybe over sells, at times, but who the fuck was writing for him? Terrible.

The Hogan Warrior match at Halloween Havoc 98 might be the worst wrestling match I’ve ever seen. What an absolute debacle. Then a month later Kevin Nash beats Goldberg for the World title and WCW is on their way down quickly.

[cmd24]

For some reason, the WWE Network doesn't have Halloween Havoc '98. Warrior vs. Hogan. I think I've become too cynical about WCW storylines, because I'm HATING this Warrior/Hogan angle. It seems that Warrior left fairly quietly after this, or Starrcade.

Another point of note...DDP is horseshit on the mic. Good worker, maybe over sells, at times, but who the fuck was writing for him? Terrible.

The Hogan Warrior match at Halloween Havoc 98 might be the worst wrestling match I’ve ever seen. What an absolute debacle. Then a month later Kevin Nash beats Goldberg for the World title and WCW is on their way down quickly.

I’d be curious about what happened with that Warrior angle. It really didn’t make much sense, in that he showed up and was gone so quickly.

I’m at the point in 99 where the NWO is t really making sense. Rick Steiner has turned heel, is wearing an NWO shirt, but isn’t really NWO. Scott Steiner, Nash, and Hogan have referenced it, and still use the music, but they aren’t really NWO, either. Luger has just come back to help Sting against the Steiner’s. The decline of WCW is very apparent already at this point.

[Cobey]

For some reason, the WWE Network doesn't have Halloween Havoc '98. Warrior vs. Hogan. I think I've become too cynical about WCW storylines, because I'm HATING this Warrior/Hogan angle. It seems that Warrior left fairly quietly after this, or Starrcade.

Another point of note...DDP is horseshit on the mic. Good worker, maybe over sells, at times, but who the fuck was writing for him? Terrible.

The Hogan Warrior match at Halloween Havoc 98 might be the worst wrestling match I’ve ever seen. What an absolute debacle. Then a month later Kevin Nash beats Goldberg for the World title and WCW is on their way down quickly.

I’d be curious about what happened with that Warrior angle. It really didn’t make much sense, in that he showed up and was gone so quickly.

I’m at the point in 99 where the NWO is t really making sense. Rick Steiner has turned heel, is wearing an NWO shirt, but isn’t really NWO. Scott Steiner, Nash, and Hogan have referenced it, and still use the music, but they aren’t really NWO, either. Luger has just come back to help Sting against the Steiner’s. The decline of WCW is very apparent already at this point.

The rumor about that Hogan vs Warrior match is that Hogan had so much pull backstage that he had Bischoff/Turner hire Warrior strictly so that he could get his win back from him from WM 6.

Not sure if I necessarily believe it, but it doesn't seem to be out of character for some of the other stories/rumors surrounding Hogan.

[cmd24]

The Hogan Warrior match at Halloween Havoc 98 might be the worst wrestling match I’ve ever seen. What an absolute debacle. Then a month later Kevin Nash beats Goldberg for the World title and WCW is on their way down quickly.

I’d be curious about what happened with that Warrior angle. It really didn’t make much sense, in that he showed up and was gone so quickly.

I’m at the point in 99 where the NWO is t really making sense. Rick Steiner has turned heel, is wearing an NWO shirt, but isn’t really NWO. Scott Steiner, Nash, and Hogan have referenced it, and still use the music, but they aren’t really NWO, either. Luger has just come back to help Sting against the Steiner’s. The decline of WCW is very apparent already at this point.

The rumor about that Hogan vs Warrior match is that Hogan had so much pull backstage that he had Bischoff/Turner hire Warrior strictly so that he could get his win back from him from WM 6.

Not sure if I necessarily believe it, but it doesn't seem to be out of character for some of the other stories/rumors surrounding Hogan.

That Hogan angle is interesting. So many talk about how great he was for the industry, but then every once in a while you’ll hear somebody drop little nuggets about him being tough to work with.

[Cobey]

I’d be curious about what happened with that Warrior angle. It really didn’t make much sense, in that he showed up and was gone so quickly.

I’m at the point in 99 where the NWO is t really making sense. Rick Steiner has turned heel, is wearing an NWO shirt, but isn’t really NWO. Scott Steiner, Nash, and Hogan have referenced it, and still use the music, but they aren’t really NWO, either. Luger has just come back to help Sting against the Steiner’s. The decline of WCW is very apparent already at this point.

The rumor about that Hogan vs Warrior match is that Hogan had so much pull backstage that he had Bischoff/Turner hire Warrior strictly so that he could get his win back from him from WM 6.

Not sure if I necessarily believe it, but it doesn't seem to be out of character for some of the other stories/rumors surrounding Hogan.

That Hogan angle is interesting. So many talk about how great he was for the industry, but then every once in a while you’ll hear somebody drop little nuggets about him being tough to work with.

Jesse Ventura has famously said that he tried to unionize the WWF locker room. Everybody was on board except Hogan and Hogan allegedly snitched on Ventura to McMahon. Whether that's good or bad is debatable, but he was definitely in business for himself.

[cmd24]

The rumor about that Hogan vs Warrior match is that Hogan had so much pull backstage that he had Bischoff/Turner hire Warrior strictly so that he could get his win back from him from WM 6.

Not sure if I necessarily believe it, but it doesn't seem to be out of character for some of the other stories/rumors surrounding Hogan.

That Hogan angle is interesting. So many talk about how great he was for the industry, but then every once in a while you’ll hear somebody drop little nuggets about him being tough to work with.

Jesse Ventura has famously said that he tried to unionize the WWF locker room. Everybody was on board except Hogan and Hogan allegedly snitched on Ventura to McMahon. Whether that's good or bad is debatable, but he was definitely in business for himself.

You can kind of see that with the way he gets the belt the last few times. Between the Finger Poke of Doom, and how easily he got the belt when he got back from knee surgery here in the summer of 99. Probably in the way that he managed to keep it for such long periods, too.

[cmd24]

August 9, 1999 sees the return of Hulkamania in yellow and red.

[Cobey]

How deep are you planning on going cmd?

I'm curious if you plan on tracking this through the "Invasion" or just stop when Vince buys them out.

[Herky]

WCW and the NWO was the shit back in college. Loved it. Must see TV for our dorm/house.

Same. My roommates and I would order pizza on Monday nights, and watch Nitro Live. We'd tape Raw and then watch it after Nitro was over. Lots of beer too.

We'd also tune in on Thursday's for WCW Thunder while pre-gaming for the bars, and the same for WCW Shotgun Saturday Night.

We'd get all the WCW and WWE pay per views as well and get a keg of beer, and make feasts for them.

We even went to a WCW Thunder show in Cedar Rapids and ended up partying with The Psycho Janetty all night. Ended the night at Happy Chief and then dropped him off at his hotel.

Great times. I miss those days of wrestling. I watch Smackdown sometimes on Friday's but can't get into it like I used to.

[cmd24]

How deep are you planning on going cmd?

I'm curious if you plan on tracking this through the "Invasion" or just stop when Vince buys them out.

I didn't see this until just now.

I'm not fully decided on how far I'm going to go. Originally my plan was to go to the end of WCW. However, there are a lot storylines thru the early 2000's that I didn't follow closely, but tuned in occasionally, due to other commitments. I do think I'd like to get in to the late 2000's, though.

The WCW is just trash at this stage (September 1999). Storylines are weak (Sting turned heel, after suddenly being best friends with Hogan; this Sid Vicious shit is dumb leading up to his match with Goldberg at Halloween Havoc; Page and the Jersey Triad; West Texas Rednecks). The separation between the two companies is even bigger when you look at the overall mic skills (I think those are pretty important) of the companies as a whole. Tony Shiavone is no JR, and while I think Heenan is freaking great, he's no Lawler. You can see that WCW isn't even getting pop from the crowds, in comparison to WWE. The venues are smaller. Hell, even the ring is smaller. At the peak of the 83 week run, you could see that the WWE production wasn't as good, and venues felt similar, on the broadcast. Now, WWE is playing to bigger crowds in bigger venues. WCW feels more forced in their "acting", where WWE feels a lot more natural.

I was never a huge Jericho fan, but holy shit was that pop amazing when he finally showed up on Raw. You could even see it in Rock's face.