What about Drake Maye?

[cdr2529]

So you believe that the Vikings only think that maybe is the franchise QB? If so they will not get into the top five

Yep, I believe this is what is happening.

Hopefully WASH wants Daniels.

Maye is the guy they really want, it’s not a question at this point.

Do I think they would trade into the top 5 for someone other than Maye? I don’t think so. There might be a shot they would go after McCarthy but I don’t think they would pay the price that some other team will if he is to go in the top 5. I don’t know what to really think of them and Daniels. I have no clue on that one if they like him or not.

Even better yet I hope WASH takes JJ.

I am hoping for either Maye or Daniels but McCarthy would make me give up on the Vikings and I would not trade not one pick for McCarthy

[RubeTube]

Maye is the guy they really want, it’s not a question at this point.

Do I think they would trade into the top 5 for someone other than Maye? I don’t think so. There might be a shot they would go after McCarthy but I don’t think they would pay the price that some other team will if he is to go in the top 5. I don’t know what to really think of them and Daniels. I have no clue on that one if they like him or not.

Even better yet I hope WASH takes JJ.

I am hoping for either Maye or Daniels but McCarthy would make me give up on the Vikings and I would not trade not one pick for McCarthy

I would give him a chance but I don’t care for him either. Like I said, if they can get him at #11, It’s whatever. I won’t love it nor hate it. It’s just meh to me. Trading our picks for him though? No way Jose.

I would be happy with Daniels but Maye is the guy.

[Beef Supreme]

I don't believe they have a handshake deal because they would complete the deal unless the Vikings think they can go higher to the commander pick otherwise no reason to wait.

Handshake deal means we want Maye and the Patriots have already agreed to compensation for the 3 pick. But if Washington takes Maye, then we don't want it. That's why it hasn't happened.


It's speculation, but that's what it could be.

Understand but they need to get there anyway if they want their franchise QB and Daniels could be it as well

Possible the Vikings like Maye enough to go get him and not Daniels.

[-VikingsTw-]

I really like Daniels but his body type probably keeps me from putting that kind of capital into a trade for him. Long term and how he runs it's risky. He's a fun prospect though and I don't completely hate it.

I think you guys are right and trade would be for Maye. Elite QB build and size, 21 years old, freak arm talent... Makes a lot of sense.

Washington is keeping it close to the vest, I'm not even sure they know what their doing yet.

[Butch Bradford]

I really like Daniels but his body type probably keeps me from putting that kind of capital into a trade for him. Long term and how he runs it's risky. He's a fun prospect though and I don't completely hate it.

I think you guys are right and trade would be for Maye. Elite QB build and size, 21 years old, freak arm talent... Makes a lot of sense.

Washington is keeping it close to the vest, I'm not even sure they know what their doing yet.

It's all subterfuge.

They are fishing for the highest bidder.

imo, WAS, like NE, are in no position to take a franchise QB.

They have too many infrastructure team needs to build around one.

[weimy froob]

I really like Daniels but his body type probably keeps me from putting that kind of capital into a trade for him. Long term and how he runs it's risky. He's a fun prospect though and I don't completely hate it.

I think you guys are right and trade would be for Maye. Elite QB build and size, 21 years old, freak arm talent... Makes a lot of sense.

Washington is keeping it close to the vest, I'm not even sure they know what their doing yet.

It's all subterfuge.

They are fishing for the highest bidder.

imo, WAS, like NE, are in no position to take a franchise QB.

They have too many infrastructure team needs to build around one.

that wouldn't be my philosophy if i was the GM butch. get your QB. you can rebuild an NFL team relatively quickly. the texans are on the extreme of that--but two years is plenty of time to get it done.

[Butch Bradford]

I really like Daniels but his body type probably keeps me from putting that kind of capital into a trade for him. Long term and how he runs it's risky. He's a fun prospect though and I don't completely hate it.

I think you guys are right and trade would be for Maye. Elite QB build and size, 21 years old, freak arm talent... Makes a lot of sense.

Washington is keeping it close to the vest, I'm not even sure they know what their doing yet.

It's all subterfuge.

They are fishing for the highest bidder.

imo, WAS, like NE, are in no position to take a franchise QB.

They have too many infrastructure team needs to build around one.

that wouldn't be my philosophy if i was the GM butch. get your QB. you can rebuild an NFL team relatively quickly. the texans are on the extreme of that--but two years is plenty of time to get it done.

There is a fly in your proverbial ointment.

If they don't have the infrastructure and offensive coaching, that a young potential franchise QB needs, it could ruin his career.

I mean, what if another team drafted Patrick Mahomes?

Would he be the same player as he is today?

Or look at what happened to Sam Darnold or Zach Wilson.

See my point?

[weimy froob]

It's all subterfuge.

They are fishing for the highest bidder.

imo, WAS, like NE, are in no position to take a franchise QB.

They have too many infrastructure team needs to build around one.

that wouldn't be my philosophy if i was the GM butch. get your QB. you can rebuild an NFL team relatively quickly. the texans are on the extreme of that--but two years is plenty of time to get it done.

There is a fly in your proverbial ointment.

If they don't have the infrastructure and offensive coaching, that a young potential franchise QB needs, it could ruin his career.

I mean, what if another team drafted Patrick Mahomes?

Would he be the same player as he is today?

Or look at what happened to Sam Darnold or Zach Wilson.

See my point?

i do--but there's a bigger point that has been made in the forum. nothing really matters if you don't have your QB. you're in a prime spot in a relatively strong QB draft. you take your QB and sit him for at least half the season while you're in your rebuild. this "ruin his career" angle is overblown imo. more often than not, the guy really wasn't very good. two years is enough time for a quality GM and coach to field a competitive team. if you're competitive then the QB could be the difference between a W and an L.

[Beef Supreme]

There are different philosophies about how to build a roster and you can find historical evidence that either can work. Troy Aikman was drafted to a shit Cowboys team and they were able to build around him. Patrick Mahomes went to an already good Chiefs team. Either way can work. And you can also find instances of both philosophies failing too.

But there’s a lot of smoke coming out of New England that they’re willing to trade. Could be a mirage, but I’m not sure what the Patriots really have to gain with statements indicating the pick is for sale if it isn’t.

[weimy froob]

There are different philosophies about how to build a roster and you can find historical evidence that either can work. Troy Aikman was drafted to a shit Cowboys team and they were able to build around him. Patrick Mahomes went to an already good Chiefs team. Either way can work. And you can also find instances of both philosophies failing too.

But there’s a lot of smoke coming out of New England that they’re willing to trade. Could be a mirage, but I’m not sure what the Patriots really have to gain with statements indicating the pick is for sale if it isn’t.

i think you just don't take a QB at or near the top of the draft if you aren't completely in on the guy. if you are then you take him. i can't see washington taking a pass this year/but new england could i guess.

the quality of the offensive line more than the offensive weapons would influence how many snaps i'd give him behind center in that first year. garbage time would be alright if the line is terrible. if you're up to adequate then potential starts late in the season could be in play. a quality offensive line would move the time table up even more. that might be unlikely if the counter argument is that the pick could be in play because the talent dearth--but it still could.

[Oriole81]

There are different philosophies about how to build a roster and you can find historical evidence that either can work. Troy Aikman was drafted to a shit Cowboys team and they were able to build around him. Patrick Mahomes went to an already good Chiefs team. Either way can work. And you can also find instances of both philosophies failing too.

But there’s a lot of smoke coming out of New England that they’re willing to trade. Could be a mirage, but I’m not sure what the Patriots really have to gain with statements indicating the pick is for sale if it isn’t.

i think you just don't take a QB at or near the top of the draft if you aren't completely in on the guy. if you are then you take him. i can't see washington taking a pass this year/but new england could i guess.

the quality of the offensive line more than the offensive weapons would influence how many snaps i'd give him behind center in that first year. garbage time would be alright if the line is terrible. if you're up to adequate then potential starts late in the season could be in play. a quality offensive line would move the time table up even more. that might be unlikely if the counter argument is that the pick could be in play because the talent dearth--but it still could.

I think it's one thing to pass over the QB if there's a dominant other player available, like QB needy teams that passed on in order to draft guys like Myles Garrett, Mario Williams, Nick Bosa, Chase Young etc, but that's not really the case in this draft.

There's no singularly great defensive player and OL that high doesn't move the needle as much as some think it does, so passing over the QB this year just to say you did it isn't a great strategy this year either.

[Beef Supreme]

There are different philosophies about how to build a roster and you can find historical evidence that either can work. Troy Aikman was drafted to a shit Cowboys team and they were able to build around him. Patrick Mahomes went to an already good Chiefs team. Either way can work. And you can also find instances of both philosophies failing too.

But there’s a lot of smoke coming out of New England that they’re willing to trade. Could be a mirage, but I’m not sure what the Patriots really have to gain with statements indicating the pick is for sale if it isn’t.

i think you just don't take a QB at or near the top of the draft if you aren't completely in on the guy. if you are then you take him. i can't see washington taking a pass this year/but new england could i guess.

the quality of the offensive line more than the offensive weapons would influence how many snaps i'd give him behind center in that first year. garbage time would be alright if the line is terrible. if you're up to adequate then potential starts late in the season could be in play. a quality offensive line would move the time table up even more. that might be unlikely if the counter argument is that the pick could be in play because the talent dearth--but it still could.

I think it's one thing to pass over the QB if there's a dominant other player available, like QB needy teams that passed on in order to draft guys like Myles Garrett, Mario Williams, Nick Bosa, Chase Young etc, but that's not really the case in this draft.

There's no singularly great defensive player and OL that high doesn't move the needle as much as some think it does, so passing over the QB this year just to say you did it isn't a great strategy this year either.

MHJ is probably the only one. Some say OT Alt, but I’m not sure he’s quite on that level.


But it would be weird to need a QB and draft a WR instead. You’d really have to have the WR graded way above the QB to do that.


And I agree that there’s no defensive player that rates that high. I think there’s a chance no defensive player goes in the top-10. One probably will, but there’s a chance none do. 4 QBs, 3 WRs, and at least one OT could easily go top-10. If another OT and then TE Bowers go (possible), then defense starts at 11.

[Oriole81]

i think you just don't take a QB at or near the top of the draft if you aren't completely in on the guy. if you are then you take him. i can't see washington taking a pass this year/but new england could i guess.

the quality of the offensive line more than the offensive weapons would influence how many snaps i'd give him behind center in that first year. garbage time would be alright if the line is terrible. if you're up to adequate then potential starts late in the season could be in play. a quality offensive line would move the time table up even more. that might be unlikely if the counter argument is that the pick could be in play because the talent dearth--but it still could.

I think it's one thing to pass over the QB if there's a dominant other player available, like QB needy teams that passed on in order to draft guys like Myles Garrett, Mario Williams, Nick Bosa, Chase Young etc, but that's not really the case in this draft.

There's no singularly great defensive player and OL that high doesn't move the needle as much as some think it does, so passing over the QB this year just to say you did it isn't a great strategy this year either.

MHJ is probably the only one. Some say OT Alt, but I’m not sure he’s quite on that level.


But it would be weird to need a QB and draft a WR instead. You’d really have to have the WR graded way above the QB to do that.


And I agree that there’s no defensive player that rates that high. I think there’s a chance no defensive player goes in the top-10. One probably will, but there’s a chance none do. 4 QBs, 3 WRs, and at least one OT could easily go top-10. If another OT and then TE Bowers go (possible), then defense starts at 11.

Calvin Johnson and Joe Thomas were about the best you could hope for out of a Top 2 selected WR/OT, and there was only so much of an impact they could do to their team's success.

[-VikingsTw-]

I really like Daniels but his body type probably keeps me from putting that kind of capital into a trade for him. Long term and how he runs it's risky. He's a fun prospect though and I don't completely hate it.

I think you guys are right and trade would be for Maye. Elite QB build and size, 21 years old, freak arm talent... Makes a lot of sense.

Washington is keeping it close to the vest, I'm not even sure they know what their doing yet.

It's all subterfuge.

They are fishing for the highest bidder.

imo, WAS, like NE, are in no position to take a franchise QB.

They have too many infrastructure team needs to build around one.

Your not wrong but I still think it's hard to get in a position where you can take a guy as good as these top 3. JJ is the wild card here, it might be 4. Gonna be super interesting to re rank all these guys in 4-5 years.

It's definitely not a good situation for a rookie QB but it's never stopped any of the teams in the past.

New England is making it pretty clear they are down to trade, there really isn't any reason for them to say otherwise. If I was them I'm taking a QB but they just spent decades with a GM that brainwashed them to trade down only. That entire thing was carried by Tom Brady. When you got Tom Brady you can do whatever you want and it will work. They made some good picks and made a bunch of bad ones.

[Beef Supreme]

I think it's one thing to pass over the QB if there's a dominant other player available, like QB needy teams that passed on in order to draft guys like Myles Garrett, Mario Williams, Nick Bosa, Chase Young etc, but that's not really the case in this draft.

There's no singularly great defensive player and OL that high doesn't move the needle as much as some think it does, so passing over the QB this year just to say you did it isn't a great strategy this year either.

MHJ is probably the only one. Some say OT Alt, but I’m not sure he’s quite on that level.


But it would be weird to need a QB and draft a WR instead. You’d really have to have the WR graded way above the QB to do that.


And I agree that there’s no defensive player that rates that high. I think there’s a chance no defensive player goes in the top-10. One probably will, but there’s a chance none do. 4 QBs, 3 WRs, and at least one OT could easily go top-10. If another OT and then TE Bowers go (possible), then defense starts at 11.

Calvin Johnson and Joe Thomas were about the best you could hope for out of a Top 2 selected WR/OT, and there was only so much of an impact they could do to their team's success.

You’re not wrong, but given how the Lions and Browns were run during their eras, I’m not sure there’s a player in NFL history that leads those teams to sustained high-level success.

[Beef Supreme]

I really like Daniels but his body type probably keeps me from putting that kind of capital into a trade for him. Long term and how he runs it's risky. He's a fun prospect though and I don't completely hate it.

I think you guys are right and trade would be for Maye. Elite QB build and size, 21 years old, freak arm talent... Makes a lot of sense.

Washington is keeping it close to the vest, I'm not even sure they know what their doing yet.

It's all subterfuge.

They are fishing for the highest bidder.

imo, WAS, like NE, are in no position to take a franchise QB.

They have too many infrastructure team needs to build around one.

Your not wrong but I still think it's hard to get in a position where you can take a guy as good as these top 3. JJ is the wild card here, it might be 4. Gonna be super interesting to re rank all these guys in 4-5 years.

It's definitely not a good situation for a rookie QB but it's never stopped any of the teams in the past.

New England is making it pretty clear they are down to trade, there really isn't any reason for them to say otherwise. If I was them I'm taking a QB but they just spent decades with a GM that brainwashed them to trade down only. That entire thing was carried by Tom Brady. When you got Tom Brady you can do whatever you want and it will work. They made some good picks and made a bunch of bad ones.

Maybe they’re thinking you build a really strong team and develop a less ballyhooed QB to success. They could trade back for a haul and try to build around Nix or Penix (or Rattler or whoever if they like someone). Tom Brady was not a prolific passer early in his career. That developed over time.

[Oriole81]

MHJ is probably the only one. Some say OT Alt, but I’m not sure he’s quite on that level.


But it would be weird to need a QB and draft a WR instead. You’d really have to have the WR graded way above the QB to do that.


And I agree that there’s no defensive player that rates that high. I think there’s a chance no defensive player goes in the top-10. One probably will, but there’s a chance none do. 4 QBs, 3 WRs, and at least one OT could easily go top-10. If another OT and then TE Bowers go (possible), then defense starts at 11.

Calvin Johnson and Joe Thomas were about the best you could hope for out of a Top 2 selected WR/OT, and there was only so much of an impact they could do to their team's success.

You’re not wrong, but given how the Lions and Browns were run during their eras, I’m not sure there’s a player in NFL history that leads those teams to sustained high-level success.

Also true, but if you're a truly well run organization then it's that much easier to find OTs and WRs.

[Beef Supreme]

Calvin Johnson and Joe Thomas were about the best you could hope for out of a Top 2 selected WR/OT, and there was only so much of an impact they could do to their team's success.

You’re not wrong, but given how the Lions and Browns were run during their eras, I’m not sure there’s a player in NFL history that leads those teams to sustained high-level success.

Also true, but if you're a truly well run organization then it's that much easier to find OTs and WRs.

True.


There’s a lot of different ways to make this happen.

[-VikingsTw-]

Maybe they’re thinking you build a really strong team and develop a less ballyhooed QB to success. They could trade back for a haul and try to build around Nix or Penix (or Rattler or whoever if they like someone). Tom Brady was not a prolific passer early in his career. That developed over time.

Wouldn't doubt that at all. A defensive mind leading your team with a bad roster needing to load up draft picks...

Makes a lot of sense. I don't think there is a right or wrong with how they approach the move.

[R403]

It's all subterfuge.

They are fishing for the highest bidder.

imo, WAS, like NE, are in no position to take a franchise QB.

They have too many infrastructure team needs to build around one.

Your not wrong but I still think it's hard to get in a position where you can take a guy as good as these top 3. JJ is the wild card here, it might be 4. Gonna be super interesting to re rank all these guys in 4-5 years.

It's definitely not a good situation for a rookie QB but it's never stopped any of the teams in the past.

New England is making it pretty clear they are down to trade, there really isn't any reason for them to say otherwise. If I was them I'm taking a QB but they just spent decades with a GM that brainwashed them to trade down only. That entire thing was carried by Tom Brady. When you got Tom Brady you can do whatever you want and it will work. They made some good picks and made a bunch of bad ones.

Maybe they’re thinking you build a really strong team and develop a less ballyhooed QB to success. They could trade back for a haul and try to build around Nix or Penix (or Rattler or whoever if they like someone). Tom Brady was not a prolific passer early in his career. That developed over time.

I would stay at 11 pick the best defensive player then get a QB at 23. Why give up three first round draft pick when you really don’t know how good any of these guys are going to be for sure. People claim they know, but in reality no one really knows.

[Beef Supreme]

Maybe they’re thinking you build a really strong team and develop a less ballyhooed QB to success. They could trade back for a haul and try to build around Nix or Penix (or Rattler or whoever if they like someone). Tom Brady was not a prolific passer early in his career. That developed over time.

Wouldn't doubt that at all. A defensive mind leading your team with a bad roster needing to load up draft picks...

Makes a lot of sense. I don't think there is a right or wrong with how they approach the move.

Right. And if you don’t love the QBs available at your pick for your offense (and evaluations on all theses guys different greatly; as does fit for various schemes), then trading down has a lot more value to sticking and picking a QB you don’t believe in who doesn’t fit your offense.

[-VikingsTw-]

Now it all makes sense... Why did Chris Simms throw in the flag with Drake Maye? This youtuber has done all the top QB's, every throw of the 2023 season in ORDER.

Maye started the season very good but by the time this thing was over it was BRUTAL. About as ying and yang as you could possibly get. I would have a real hard time giving up 3 first round picks after watching this in full. It's not so much taking a swing on Drake Maye with A first round pick as it is giving up a bunch of capital to do it. At some point you just say I can't give 3 first round picks for this guy. It's all over the place. It's amazing and terribly bad at the same time.


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[minnemike]

Now it all makes sense... Why did Chris Simms throw in the flag with Drake Maye? This youtuber has done all the top QB's, every throw of the 2023 season in ORDER.

Maye started the season very good but by the time this thing was over it was BRUTAL. About as ying and yang as you could possibly get. I would have a real hard time giving up 3 first round picks after watching this in full. It's not so much taking a swing on Drake Maye with A first round pick as it is giving up a bunch of capital to do it. At some point you just say I can't give 3 first round picks for this guy. It's all over the place. It's amazing and terribly bad at the same time.


Click here to learn how to add YouTube Videos to your phpBB forum

The take on Maye's 2023 is that he lost all the talent around him as well as a coaching staff and replaced with crap, similar to Josh Allen's final college year. Most are giving him somewhat of a pass based on that.

[-VikingsTw-]

He started well but it faded. I'm not really sure what the difference was in the surrounding cast... The first half and 2nd half. You watch his first few games and your sold then it got so bad that's hard to explain. Super erratic throwing.

[D_H]

The Minnesota Vikings like Drake Maye the most of the other quarterbacks in the draft.

Coach Kevin O'Connell in particular sees the North Carolina QB with a high floor and tremendous pocket presence.

Via FOX Sports reporter Carmen Vitali.

[William Munny]

The Minnesota Vikings like Drake Maye the most of the other quarterbacks in the draft.

Coach Kevin O'Connell in particular sees the North Carolina QB with a high floor and tremendous pocket presence.

Via FOX Sports reporter Carmen Vitali.

Sounds like Sam Darnold.

[cunningham]

The Pats just took Mac Jones fairly high in the draft and now have a shot again. They will take it.

We can only hope that by some chance of fate we pick the right quarterback in this draft.

Having said that, if KOC and his staff believe in Maye you make the trade of this years firsts and next year’s. Beyond that would be too much.

What if JJ is a winner and it translates to the NFL? Maye seems a bit overhyped.

But is it just over analyzing?

[Beef Supreme]

None of us know for sure.

Guy on kfan today had them ranked:

Williams
Penix
Nix
Daniels
JJ
Maye

Said we should stay away for JJ and Maye. They both need too much work. Said he’d sit tight with our picks and take Penix and a defensive player.


So opinions are all over the place. Nobody knows. Some folks might end up right, but they just got lucky with a guess. Nobody knows.

[William Munny]

None of us know for sure.

Guy on kfan today had them ranked:

Williams
Penix
Nix
Daniels
JJ
Maye

Said we should stay away for JJ and Maye. They both need too much work. Said he’d sit tight with our picks and take Penix and a defensive player.


So opinions are all over the place. Nobody knows. Some folks might end up right, but they just got lucky with a guess. Nobody knows.

That dude is smoking some strong shit.

[Beef Supreme]

None of us know for sure.

Guy on kfan today had them ranked:

Williams
Penix
Nix
Daniels
JJ
Maye

Said we should stay away for JJ and Maye. They both need too much work. Said he’d sit tight with our picks and take Penix and a defensive player.


So opinions are all over the place. Nobody knows. Some folks might end up right, but they just got lucky with a guess. Nobody knows.

That dude is smoking some strong shit.

He didn’t predict they’d go in that order. That was the order he liked them. He said the best value was Penix. He felt we could probably get him at 23 and get a defender at 11. He acknowledged his was a dissenting opinion and the draft wouldn’t likely fall that way.