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Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

A place to discuss the MN Timberwolves
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YBBR
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by YBBR »

UnFadeable21 wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:00 pm No picks

Players only
I'd throw in a second.
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Ballin36
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Ballin36 »

Hawks have won 8 in a row and are now 10-1 under McMillian with Hunter due back soon. Collins has been a big part of that, seriously doubt he is traded. And this article claims they have cap space when they don’t.

Magic are bad with another blowout loss tonight. I think it’s 50/50 Gordon is traded bc Orlando values him higher than most. He’s a bad fit on their roster.
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mglviks
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by mglviks »

I don't think it is far off.

I wouldn't cry if we had made the deal..

Good starting point.

Do feel like it needs to be expanded.

Getting Reddish, Hueter or OO included could push it over the edge..

Money wise if we could move Jauncho, Culver/okogie and Rubio into something they'd take. Or into expirings. To cover Collins next deal is needed.
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Mplsfonz
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Mplsfonz »

KevinBaconIsNotMyHero wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:01 pm Atlanta obviously doesn’t want the 1st protected. So you folks clamoring for the deal on the basis of Beasley and a protected 1st are probably delusional. And there’s absolutely no way I’m giving up an unprotected 1st and Beasley on a reasonable deal to get Collins, a big who’s mediocre defensively and about to be paid 25 million dollars a season. Only the Wolves would pay two bigs almost 60 million per year.
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Mplsfonz
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Mplsfonz »

digitalwolf wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 7:31 pm I'm a Collins guy, but even though we need a starting PF, I'd still argue we need plenty of shooting. Unless you think Nowell replaces the bombs Beas can drop, I don't see how you move him at all without good shooting from outside coming back. As big of a fan of Collins I am, Beasley is a better player in todays NBA, and he's making less money than what Collins is asking for. If Collins was more of a defensive piece, I could see more value for him....but since ATL has already said they'll match any offer, it seems silly to give up our only good assets for a guy we could just bid on in the offseason. Yes, I know we don't have space currently, but everyone here knows how quickly that can change. It's going to have to be a three team deal, but if we were to give up Beasley and a first of any protection, we would have to get back more than John Collins. Again, love Collins, but he's not as gifted as a scorer, he's not a great rebounder or defender (however, fine enough) and he's going to want more money than Beas. If Beas were like 29 or 30, it be easier to move on, but he's just now scratching his surface at 24 and he's locked up, again, for less than what Collins will make. If Collins showed out to be a shot blocker or something, I'd get it, but while he's an upgrade, he's not worth Beasley, let alone Beasley and a first.
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Mplsfonz
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Mplsfonz »

YBBR wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 9:01 pm I was into the Collins hype in that draft as he was shooting up draft boards. Still could have taken him instead of Justin Patton!!!
Yeah, but would he have developed here? I think not.

I remember wanting Jarrett Allen. And hindsight....Kuzma wouldn't have looked bad either. :irked:
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Mplsfonz
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Mplsfonz »

LordNu wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:05 pm
bubu dubu. wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:03 pm
LordNu wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 9:55 pm

I think you should look up this guy called Hoiberg. Ain't nobody touching him as the Wolves best 3pt shooter.
In the theoretical that Beasley stays here for multiple years and continues to shoot around 40%, I think it would be subjective. Fred shot great here for 2 years, and did it as a bit player, playing about 20 mpg, and shooting about 2 threes per game. If Beasley were to play 4-6 years here, and continued to shoot around 40% from 3, putting up 8.5 3's a game in 30+ mpg, he would shatter Wolves records for 3 point shooting.
True, the difference I was pointing at was percentage. Hoiberg hit .442 one season and then .483!
Yeah, but he only shot like 2 per game, and he came off the bench. (Fresh legs) Beasley is a starter playing 30+ mins and putting up almost 9 per game. I think the Mayor would have had a hard time doing that considering he was awful before he got here.
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Moses Scurry
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Moses Scurry »

If you just look at stats, Beasley is like the 10th-15th best SG in the league. Low in assists, middle in rebs, high ppg, 3%, 3pa, probably rated poor on D. Drop off to Nowell is considerable. Is Collins way better than our platoon at PF? Collins + Nowell vs. Vando/McDaniels + Beasley?
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Mplsfonz
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Mplsfonz »

T_J wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:33 pm
YBBR wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 9:04 pm
T_J wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 8:35 pm Atlanta is thoroughly in the playoff mix having won 8 straight.

Why are they going to shake up their team again?
They don't want to pay Collins. That's pretty much it.
If that’s the case, they can play him out this year and he can take a RFA offer this summer. Why from their perspective would they make a Beasley and a 1st move which is at best a neutral move for this year given how they’ve played of late.
Because someone may make an offer and then they have his rights. I can just see Atl. taking a lowball offer for him and watch this place go nuts.

Off subject. Gordon asked for a trade and may not cost us the bank to get. He plays better D, and doesn't need to score to be effective. He IMHO is a better fit next to KAT and I doubt he asks for the max after next year. Collins will not want the QO and will be at the max. Lo, KAT and Collins making almost $100 mil? Guess we can suit of some guys from the YMCA. :roll:
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by jodaman01 »

Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:10 pm If you just look at stats, Beasley is like the 10th-15th best SG in the league. Low in assists, middle in rebs, high ppg, 3%, 3pa, probably rated poor on D. Drop off to Nowell is considerable. Is Collins way better than our platoon at PF? Collins + Nowell vs. Vando/McDaniels + Beasley?
Wolves have played their best stretch of basketball without Beasley on the floor, and without DLO on the floor.

Odd.
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Mplsfonz
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Mplsfonz »

Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:10 pm If you just look at stats, Beasley is like the 10th-15th best SG in the league. Low in assists, middle in rebs, high ppg, 3%, 3pa, probably rated poor on D. Drop off to Nowell is considerable. Is Collins way better than our platoon at PF? Collins + Nowell vs. Vando/McDaniels + Beasley?
Vandy is our best D player, and MacD is going to be a stud. In no way do we ship them out for someone who we don't even know wants to be here. (Win now mode doesn't work for us to well.)
I feel the same about Beas. He already saw how we traded for him, then stuck with him when he needed someone the most. His loyalty may get to a KG type here. But some rubes want to bash him for his off court crap. Would prefer he stay clean, but he gives it his all on the court and plays with heart. AND....And he WANTS to be here. Didn't try and break the bank or hold out. Player friendly contract. What more could we ask for?
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Mplsfonz
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Mplsfonz »

jodaman01 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:18 pm
Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:10 pm If you just look at stats, Beasley is like the 10th-15th best SG in the league. Low in assists, middle in rebs, high ppg, 3%, 3pa, probably rated poor on D. Drop off to Nowell is considerable. Is Collins way better than our platoon at PF? Collins + Nowell vs. Vando/McDaniels + Beasley?
Wolves have played their best stretch of basketball without Beasley on the floor, and without DLO on the floor.

Odd.
Not odd....Finch.
He's a real coach.
populousample
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by populousample »

Beasleys and Rubios stock are high right now. Others are climbing due to Finch’me. One could try and maximize Beasley and Rubios value now but all in all I think everyone stock continues to rise under this coach. Stock rising in a lost season may be the best outcome the organization could focus on. Start dealing after the season.
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Moses Scurry
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Moses Scurry »

jodaman01 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:18 pm
Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:10 pm If you just look at stats, Beasley is like the 10th-15th best SG in the league. Low in assists, middle in rebs, high ppg, 3%, 3pa, probably rated poor on D. Drop off to Nowell is considerable. Is Collins way better than our platoon at PF? Collins + Nowell vs. Vando/McDaniels + Beasley?
Wolves have played their best stretch of basketball without Beasley on the floor, and without DLO on the floor.

Odd.
You need a jump to conclusions mat. Coach has nothing to do with it? :lol:

Instead of the swag-meter, we need a dunce-meter for Joda.
jodaman01
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by jodaman01 »

Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:27 pm
jodaman01 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:18 pm
Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:10 pm If you just look at stats, Beasley is like the 10th-15th best SG in the league. Low in assists, middle in rebs, high ppg, 3%, 3pa, probably rated poor on D. Drop off to Nowell is considerable. Is Collins way better than our platoon at PF? Collins + Nowell vs. Vando/McDaniels + Beasley?
Wolves have played their best stretch of basketball without Beasley on the floor, and without DLO on the floor.

Odd.
You need a jump to conclusions mat. Coach has nothing to do with it? :lol:

Instead of the swag-meter, we need a dunce-meter for Joda.
They don’t need Beasley and possibly not DLO. Nobody here is dumb enough to argue that they are perfect fits for their positions here are they?

You could use them to shore up positions like PF for years to come and likely draft picks if you move DLO.

This team could be far better without them if constructed properly by Rosas.
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Moses Scurry
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Moses Scurry »

jodaman01 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:31 pm
Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:27 pm
jodaman01 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:18 pm

Wolves have played their best stretch of basketball without Beasley on the floor, and without DLO on the floor.

Odd.
You need a jump to conclusions mat. Coach has nothing to do with it? :lol:

Instead of the swag-meter, we need a dunce-meter for Joda.
They don’t need Beasley and possibly not DLO. Nobody here is dumb enough to argue that they are perfect fits for their positions here are they?

You could use them to shore up positions like PF for years to come and likely draft picks if you move DLO.

This team could be far better without them if constructed properly by Rosas.
Your response is such a bunch of garbage based on imaginary what ifs with literally nothing behind it. And who is a replacement SG or SF? Nowell? Who are you bringing in to replace 20.5/4.6/2.5 as a FA or trade?

Here's the list of NBA SG's that take 6 or more 3's a game and shoot better than Beasley...Paul George, Rozier, Lavine, McCollum. That is it. He also has a low TO rate.
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by jodaman01 »

:evil:
Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:45 pm
jodaman01 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:31 pm
Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:27 pm

You need a jump to conclusions mat. Coach has nothing to do with it? :lol:

Instead of the swag-meter, we need a dunce-meter for Joda.
They don’t need Beasley and possibly not DLO. Nobody here is dumb enough to argue that they are perfect fits for their positions here are they?

You could use them to shore up positions like PF for years to come and likely draft picks if you move DLO.

This team could be far better without them if constructed properly by Rosas.
Your response is such a bunch of garbage based on imaginary what ifs with literally nothing behind it. And who is a replacement SG or SF? Nowell? Who are you bringing in to replace 20.5/4.6/2.5 as a FA or trade?

Here's the list of NBA SG's that take 6 or more 3's a game and shoot better than Beasley...Paul George, Rozier, Lavine, McCollum. That is it. He also has a low TO rate.
Seems you believe Beasley is perfect for the role. We’ll save this and revisit it in a while. :thumbsup:
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Moses Scurry »

It's easier to say a player is garbage, if and when this team fails for whatever reason, you can just say, look, Beasley didn't carry them to a win, he sucks. It's your method with Butler, he takes a team to the finals, he didn't win it, see, I told you we wasn't a winner even though he bent you over and made you his bitch. It's the pathetic games a 5 year old would play.

He might be one of the best non-rookie contracts in the league, salary to production.

You're honestly just pissed because Rosas found a gem and you can't stand it.

Joda logic: There are really only 3 good players in the NBA. Curry, Lebron and Kawhi.
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by jodaman01 »

Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:48 pm It's easier to say a player is garbage, if and when this team fails for whatever reason, you can just say, look, Beasley didn't carry them to a win, he sucks. It's your method with Butler, he takes a team to the finals, he didn't win it, see, I told you we wasn't a winner even though he bent you over and made you his bitch. It's the pathetic games a 5 year old would play.

He might be one of the best non-rookie contracts in the league, salary to production.

You're honestly just pissed because Rosas found a gem and you can't stand it.

Joda logic: There are really only 3 good players in the NBA. Curry, Lebron and Kawhi.
You are sold on Beasley, I’m not. I think getting a legit PF for him would make the Timberwolves better, because they already have Beasley-like replacements, and I don’t want him eating any touches from ANT.

Let’s see if Butler can win it this year.....then you can crow. Until then I own him and his supporters.

GO WOLVES!! :thumbsup:
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Moses Scurry
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Moses Scurry »

jodaman01 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 5:00 pm
Moses Scurry wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 4:48 pm It's easier to say a player is garbage, if and when this team fails for whatever reason, you can just say, look, Beasley didn't carry them to a win, he sucks. It's your method with Butler, he takes a team to the finals, he didn't win it, see, I told you we wasn't a winner even though he bent you over and made you his bitch. It's the pathetic games a 5 year old would play.

He might be one of the best non-rookie contracts in the league, salary to production.

You're honestly just pissed because Rosas found a gem and you can't stand it.

Joda logic: There are really only 3 good players in the NBA. Curry, Lebron and Kawhi.
You are sold on Beasley, I’m not. I think getting a legit PF for him would make the Timberwolves better, because they already have Beasley-like replacements, and I don’t want him eating any touches from ANT.

Let’s see if Butler can win it this year.....then you can crow. Until then I own him and his supporters.

GO WOLVES!! :thumbsup:
Only three players have been the alpha on a team and won it, those are the only guys anyone can crow about. Lebron, Curry and Kawhi. Everyone else is trash according to you.
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by T_J »

Mplsfonz wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 3:13 pm
T_J wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 10:33 pm
YBBR wrote: Sun Mar 21, 2021 9:04 pm

They don't want to pay Collins. That's pretty much it.
If that’s the case, they can play him out this year and he can take a RFA offer this summer. Why from their perspective would they make a Beasley and a 1st move which is at best a neutral move for this year given how they’ve played of late.
Because someone may make an offer and then they have his rights. I can just see Atl. taking a lowball offer for him and watch this place go nuts.

Off subject. Gordon asked for a trade and may not cost us the bank to get. He plays better D, and doesn't need to score to be effective. He IMHO is a better fit next to KAT and I doubt he asks for the max after next year. Collins will not want the QO and will be at the max. Lo, KAT and Collins making almost $100 mil? Guess we can suit of some guys from the YMCA. :roll:
Three guys on maxes who all haven’t proven much. I agree. That’s basically the hill Rosas would be choosing to die on.
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by T_J »

StFU joda. Clown fucking idiot. God dammit this board gets dumber every time you post. Stupidest troll takes. GFY and I hope you rot in hell.
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by jodaman01 »

T_J wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 7:23 pm StFU joda. Clown fucking idiot. God dammit this board gets dumber every time you post. Stupidest troll takes. GFY and I hope you rot in hell.
Wow.. seek help.
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by T_J »

jodaman01 wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 7:26 pm
T_J wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 7:23 pm StFU joda. Clown fucking idiot. God dammit this board gets dumber every time you post. Stupidest troll takes. GFY and I hope you rot in hell.
Wow.. seek help.
GFY.
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by SHAFA »

T_J wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 7:23 pm StFU joda. Clown fucking idiot. God dammit this board gets dumber every time you post. Stupidest troll takes. GFY and I hope you rot in hell.
:lol:
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by digitalwolf »

Collins, filler and 1st for Beasley, okay. Anything less, pass. Same thing with Gordon, if he cost more than a protected first and just filler, I'll pass on Gordon as well. ATL can pay Collins and someone else can use assets for Gordon, but if true, Collins price is too rich and Gordon simply isn't worth his price. Malik Beasley is currently a better player than John Collins, despite our hole at PF. He's a more versatile scorer, he's better from deep, and he's honestly defending as good and somehow only grabbing a couple of rebounds less than a guy who wants more money than him, but of course, is a PF. If We can swing Ricky into a first and change and then move a combo of that plus Oke or Culver, sure, but otherwise, he's just not worth it. And again, I'm a huge fan of John Collins since before he was drafted. But value is what it is, if ATL wants to match, that's cool....but we can't give arguably our best if not one the best shooters on our team just because we need more size. Wait till draft day and get something cheaper.
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by LordNu »

digitalwolf wrote: Mon Mar 22, 2021 9:00 pm Collins, filler and 1st for Beasley, okay. Anything less, pass. Same thing with Gordon, if he cost more than a protected first and just filler, I'll pass on Gordon as well. ATL can pay Collins and someone else can use assets for Gordon, but if true, Collins price is too rich and Gordon simply isn't worth his price. Malik Beasley is currently a better player than John Collins, despite our hole at PF. He's a more versatile scorer, he's better from deep, and he's honestly defending as good and somehow only grabbing a couple of rebounds less than a guy who wants more money than him, but of course, is a PF. If We can swing Ricky into a first and change and then move a combo of that plus Oke or Culver, sure, but otherwise, he's just not worth it. And again, I'm a huge fan of John Collins since before he was drafted. But value is what it is, if ATL wants to match, that's cool....but we can't give arguably our best if not one the best shooters on our team just because we need more size. Wait till draft day and get something cheaper.
I love how we get the first.

I'm aboard!!
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by jodaman01 »

DLO
ANT
JADEN
COLLINS
KAT

vs

DLO
BEASLEY
ANT
JADEN/V8/MACHO JAUNCHO
KAT

Rosas choked.

GO WOLVES!! :thumbsup:
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LordNu
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by LordNu »

jodaman01 wrote: Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:13 pm DLO
ANT
JADEN
COLLINS
KAT

vs

DLO
BEASLEY
ANT
JADEN/V8/MACHO JAUNCHO
KAT

Rosas choked.

GO WOLVES!! :thumbsup:
Dude, we didn't have a first... If it was simply Beasley for Collins it would have happened.
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Style
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Re: Atlanta asks for Beasley and a 1st for Collins

Post by Style »

LordNu wrote: Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:22 pm
jodaman01 wrote: Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:13 pm DLO
ANT
JADEN
COLLINS
KAT

vs

DLO
BEASLEY
ANT
JADEN/V8/MACHO JAUNCHO
KAT

Rosas choked.

GO WOLVES!! :thumbsup:
Dude, we didn't have a first... If it was simply Beasley for Collins it would have happened.
Just ignore him. It’s one thing to lean a certain direction, but it’s another to not even paint an accurate picture.

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