Philo Beddoe wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 12:28 am
For the record I think Edwards is going to start.
In fact, I would wager he is going to lead the team in minutes.
He fits small ball at the 4
He fits standard ball at the 3
He fits big ball at the 2
You can't say that about anyone else on team.
Most rookies struggle and don’t contribute to winning. Even top 3 picks. Which is fine. I’m ok with that.
But if Edwards leads the team in minutes this team is going to be bad. That’s clearly the most likely outcome if he’s playing say...34 minutes a night. So why are the Wolves trading for Rubio for a veteran presence and re-signing another guard/wing when they have no reliable bigs outside of KAT? Are they trying to win next season and make the playoffs and tell KAT and DLo this is a winning squad? Or are they developing young players like Edwards, Culver, and to a lesser extent McDaniels, Nowell, and Naz Reid? Because when you go half way, you’re going to lose some players in the shuffle.
Philo Beddoe wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 12:28 am
For the record I think Edwards is going to start.
In fact, I would wager he is going to lead the team in minutes.
He fits small ball at the 4
He fits standard ball at the 3
He fits big ball at the 2
You can't say that about anyone else on team.
Most rookies struggle and don’t contribute to winning. Even top 3 picks. Which is fine. I’m ok with that.
But if Edwards leads the team in minutes this team is going to be bad. That’s clearly the most likely outcome if he’s playing say...34 minutes a night. So why are the Wolves trading for Rubio for a veteran presence and re-signing another guard/wing when they have no reliable bigs outside of KAT? Are they trying to win next season and make the playoffs and tell KAT and DLo this is a winning squad? Or are they developing young players like Edwards, Culver, and to a lesser extent McDaniels, Nowell, and Naz Reid? Because when you go half way, you’re going to lose some players in the shuffle.
Glass half-full outlook for this season is the need for depth. A lot of games in not a lot of time. Injuries, fatigue, and matchup versatility will be crucial.
As others stated.
Cost is surprising. Thought there'd be a discount for being dumb.
I wanted him back. And glad it wasn't a lost asset.
Thought it would be like 2 for 22 maybe 2nd year PO. On a prove it.
Just a bummer it wasn't a little cheaper so we could sign juancho and a full mle.
The T’wolves sink more into a sunk cost, and the Blazers flap their wings (Friday, 11:55 p.m.)
T’wolves: Consider this: If Malik Beasley had already been signed to a four-year, $60-million deal and was playing for another team, I don’t think there’s any chance Minnesota would have exchanged a first-round pick for him.
But because the T’wolves already sunk a first-round pick into Beasley at last season’s trade deadline, it made it hard for Minnesota to walk away when the numbers got wildly far above Beasley’s projected value. The four-year, $60-million deal he signed does at least contain a fourth-year team option for Minnesota, but it definitely represents an overpay – roughly double his projected worth via BORD$ — for a team that doesn’t have huge amounts of financial flexibility.
One can also presume that Beasley’s trade value took a ding when he was arrested this offseason and charged with felony threats of violence and fifth-degree drug possession, so the “delayed sign-and-trade” angle to a deal like this isn’t as rosy as with some others.
Also, there is the little matter of the player they just took first overall playing the same position. Anthony Edwards has to start at the 2 and get the bulk of the minutes, leaving the question open of where the 6-5 Beasley might play. Further crowding the backcourt is the presence of both Ricky Rubio and DeAngelo Russell, with Russell likely taking some minutes at 2 when he pairs with Rubio.
Can Beasley play small forward as his full-time position? Certainly it seems suboptimal, and it’s unfortunate too. Meanwhile, the T’wolves are handcuffed cap wise for the next couple years. Right now Minnesota has $11 million left under the luxury tax line and 13 players under contract, plus the non-guaranteed deal of Jarred Vanderbilt, meaning the T’wolves don’t have enough remaining to both re-sign restricted free agent Juancho Hernangomez and use their full mid-level exception.
UnFadeable21 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 6:51 amMalik Beasley: Overpay
John Hollinger The Athletic
The T’wolves sink more into a sunk cost, and the Blazers flap their wings (Friday, 11:55 p.m.)
T’wolves: Consider this: If Malik Beasley had already been signed to a four-year, $60-million deal and was playing for another team, I don’t think there’s any chance Minnesota would have exchanged a first-round pick for him.
But because the T’wolves already sunk a first-round pick into Beasley at last season’s trade deadline, it made it hard for Minnesota to walk away when the numbers got wildly far above Beasley’s projected value. The four-year, $60-million deal he signed does at least contain a fourth-year team option for Minnesota, but it definitely represents an overpay – roughly double his projected worth via BORD$ — for a team that doesn’t have huge amounts of financial flexibility.
One can also presume that Beasley’s trade value took a ding when he was arrested this offseason and charged with felony threats of violence and fifth-degree drug possession, so the “delayed sign-and-trade” angle to a deal like this isn’t as rosy as with some others.
Also, there is the little matter of the player they just took first overall playing the same position. Anthony Edwards has to start at the 2 and get the bulk of the minutes, leaving the question open of where the 6-5 Beasley might play. Further crowding the backcourt is the presence of both Ricky Rubio and DeAngelo Russell, with Russell likely taking some minutes at 2 when he pairs with Rubio.
Can Beasley play small forward as his full-time position? Certainly it seems suboptimal, and it’s unfortunate too. Meanwhile, the T’wolves are handcuffed cap wise for the next couple years. Right now Minnesota has $11 million left under the luxury tax line and 13 players under contract, plus the non-guaranteed deal of Jarred Vanderbilt, meaning the T’wolves don’t have enough remaining to both re-sign restricted free agent Juancho Hernangomez and use their full mid-level exception.
Haha, what metric says Beasley is worth $7.5 million per year. Whatever BORDSS is its broken
The Timberwolves want to model their team after the Rockets... does anyone not remember early last year when you had players who could not shoot jacking up 3's and missing them?
Beasley is our Eric Gordon, he goes out there and hits 3's...
j2j wrote: ↑Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:56 pm
If Edwards doesn't start they fucked that draft up even worse than I thought. We're not winning games this year, no reason to ease him in.
This is my problem too.
Why did we acquire Rubio if we're managing in a moneyball style?
Rubio is efficient but he's a win-now player during, I hate to say it, an era that is strategically best used for development and asset acquisition.
Rubio goes against the developmental demand-grain best embodied by Edwards.
Listen, I’m pretty clearly not anti Rosas in any way. My comments and support for him on WC has been consistent. But the Rubio trade and now doubling down on another guard for 4 years 60 million is troubling. We should be developing and getting clear minutes for Edwards, Culver, and Okogie. Even Nowell. Instead it’s this half way bs where the Wolves are trading for an expensive vet who doesn’t fit Rosas preferred style, and paying a guy who optimally would be the 4th guard 15 million per season without letting him get an offer sheet. If Edwards is playing behind Beasley and Rubio and Culver on a regular basis, what the fuck is this organization doing? And if it’s Culver that’s the odd man out, what, you’ve given up on the 6th overall pick that can still develop because we need Ricky Rubio and Beasley immensely?
Completely agree with all. Hope Rosas knows what he's doing.
scares me that vandy's contract is non-guaranteed. he's got promise - but it would be so wolves to jettison a promising young player at a position of need with a tiny contract because they can't figure out their piggy bank.
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
Why did we acquire Rubio if we're managing in a moneyball style?
Rubio is efficient but he's a win-now player during, I hate to say it, an era that is strategically best used for development and asset acquisition.
Rubio goes against the developmental demand-grain best embodied by Edwards.
Listen, I’m pretty clearly not anti Rosas in any way. My comments and support for him on WC has been consistent. But the Rubio trade and now doubling down on another guard for 4 years 60 million is troubling. We should be developing and getting clear minutes for Edwards, Culver, and Okogie. Even Nowell. Instead it’s this half way bs where the Wolves are trading for an expensive vet who doesn’t fit Rosas preferred style, and paying a guy who optimally would be the 4th guard 15 million per season without letting him get an offer sheet. If Edwards is playing behind Beasley and Rubio and Culver on a regular basis, what the fuck is this organization doing? And if it’s Culver that’s the odd man out, what, you’ve given up on the 6th overall pick that can still develop because we need Ricky Rubio and Beasley immensely?
Completely agree with all. Hope Rosas knows what he's doing.
his strategy this offseason confirms (at least IMO) that he really doesn't know what he's doing. total scattergun approach that in one instance makes it look like we're in a rebuild and in another makes it looks like we're vying for a title.
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
Listen, I’m pretty clearly not anti Rosas in any way. My comments and support for him on WC has been consistent. But the Rubio trade and now doubling down on another guard for 4 years 60 million is troubling. We should be developing and getting clear minutes for Edwards, Culver, and Okogie. Even Nowell. Instead it’s this half way bs where the Wolves are trading for an expensive vet who doesn’t fit Rosas preferred style, and paying a guy who optimally would be the 4th guard 15 million per season without letting him get an offer sheet. If Edwards is playing behind Beasley and Rubio and Culver on a regular basis, what the fuck is this organization doing? And if it’s Culver that’s the odd man out, what, you’ve given up on the 6th overall pick that can still develop because we need Ricky Rubio and Beasley immensely?
Completely agree with all. Hope Rosas knows what he's doing.
his strategy this offseason confirms (at least IMO) that he really doesn't know what he's doing. total scattergun approach that in one instance makes it look like we're in a rebuild and in another makes it looks like we're vying for a title.
All your hyping here of Beasley over Booker here got the the job done....you should be over the moon ecstatic.
Congrats.....you got exactly what you were hoping for, you nailed it!
Trust The PROSAS...
GO WOLVES!!
Last edited by jodaman01 on Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
UnFadeable21 wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 6:51 amMalik Beasley: Overpay
John Hollinger The Athletic
The T’wolves sink more into a sunk cost, and the Blazers flap their wings (Friday, 11:55 p.m.)
T’wolves: Consider this: If Malik Beasley had already been signed to a four-year, $60-million deal and was playing for another team, I don’t think there’s any chance Minnesota would have exchanged a first-round pick for him.
But because the T’wolves already sunk a first-round pick into Beasley at last season’s trade deadline, it made it hard for Minnesota to walk away when the numbers got wildly far above Beasley’s projected value. The four-year, $60-million deal he signed does at least contain a fourth-year team option for Minnesota, but it definitely represents an overpay – roughly double his projected worth via BORD$ — for a team that doesn’t have huge amounts of financial flexibility.
One can also presume that Beasley’s trade value took a ding when he was arrested this offseason and charged with felony threats of violence and fifth-degree drug possession, so the “delayed sign-and-trade” angle to a deal like this isn’t as rosy as with some others.
Also, there is the little matter of the player they just took first overall playing the same position. Anthony Edwards has to start at the 2 and get the bulk of the minutes, leaving the question open of where the 6-5 Beasley might play. Further crowding the backcourt is the presence of both Ricky Rubio and DeAngelo Russell, with Russell likely taking some minutes at 2 when he pairs with Rubio.
Can Beasley play small forward as his full-time position? Certainly it seems suboptimal, and it’s unfortunate too. Meanwhile, the T’wolves are handcuffed cap wise for the next couple years. Right now Minnesota has $11 million left under the luxury tax line and 13 players under contract, plus the non-guaranteed deal of Jarred Vanderbilt, meaning the T’wolves don’t have enough remaining to both re-sign restricted free agent Juancho Hernangomez and use their full mid-level exception.
Haha, what metric says Beasley is worth $7.5 million per year. Whatever BORDSS is its broken
I'm with Hollinger.
Beasley had the 9th most minutes in Denver just behind Torrey (who?) Craig. Then he gets in gun-toting trouble.
Who else is giving up a 1st and $15M/per for that guy? When were they ever going to have more leverage in negotiations than when he was a RFA with a gun charge?
That's without the Wolves suddenly having a minor glut at the 2 spot with Rubio and Edwards added.
Completely agree with all. Hope Rosas knows what he's doing.
his strategy this offseason confirms (at least IMO) that he really doesn't know what he's doing. total scattergun approach that in one instance makes it look like we're in a rebuild and in another makes it looks like we're vying for a title.
All your hyping here of Beasley over Booker here got the the job done....you should be over the moon ecstatic.
Congrats.....you got exactly what you were hoping for, you nailed it!
Trust The PROSAS...
GO WOLVES!!
only the mind of joda could twist reality into such a pretzel. is this a box of nails ... or is it... a pony? joda will call it whatever the hell he wants.
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
The contract for Beasley is fine, assuming his play last year wasnt a fluke. Bit of an overpay, but you kinda have to to avoid having to match poison pill nonsense plus to get the team option.
It's just all the moves combined make little sense.
We've been trying to reach you about your car's extended warranty.
This will be the worst defensive team in league history. Karl is easily the worst defensive big man in the league. Beasley will continue to get in legal trouble.
qrocks wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:04 am
Many reasons not to add rubio @$17m and/or Beas @$15m while still not getting a starting PF. Zero reasons to add both without getting a starting PF.
I don’t think it may be any more complicated than Rosas was planning on running back the same team as they ended the season with. The hole he believes he may need to fill is a FRP for 2021 unless he thinks Balmero will be the proxy for that.
I underestimated this market big time... I was shocked when the numbers came out for Beasley but as the other deals started coming in, looks like it makes some sense. With a team option it's basically a 3 year deal for 45ish mil. I can live with that for now -- he was very good in the 12 games he played when he came over. He turned down 10 a year from the Nuggets and could have gotten that as a MLE from most teams.. so you knew you had to go above that (aside from the off the court issues which they must know more than us). Given the Knicks had interest, you'd assume that's probably for 12-13 a year so Minnesota gets it done with going more.
The roster needs some balancing but there's some decent depth at guard/wing.
thinktank wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:15 am
I’m a successful consultant for some of the biggest and best companies in the world. I tell you about systems architecture, not the other way around.
HeHateMe wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:04 am
I underestimated this market big time... I was shocked when the numbers came out for Beasley but as the other deals started coming in, looks like it makes some sense. With a team option it's basically a 3 year deal for 45ish mil. I can live with that for now -- he was very good in the 12 games he played when he came over. He turned down 10 a year from the Nuggets and could have gotten that as a MLE from most teams.. so you knew you had to go above that (aside from the off the court issues which they must know more than us). Given the Knicks had interest, you'd assume that's probably for 12-13 a year so Minnesota gets it done with going more.
The roster needs some balancing but there's some decent depth at guard/wing.
This is one covid year. Cap was supposed to be just over 120 I believe until this. 15 on this year's cap is a great deal for an ass busting 20 point scorer that he was. What's that like 13-14% of the total cap? For your 3rd best player? Next year when the cap starts growing again and until the end of his deal he will be a great deal. He's younger than Towns and Russell.
I love this guy. I love Edwards. Tough guy cold blooded scorers. But a whole bunch of this is going to come down to the idiot getting fired or figuring out that the 4 is an actual position. Hopefully the Edwards still growing and now being 6'6" with a 6' 10" wingspan is true so he is a natural 2-3 tweener who can rebound and defend the 3 well. He obviously needs to be on the floor with Beasley a good portion of the time. But you can't have another wing at the 4 and be so stupid to think you can win like that. Look around the league at the best teams and the up and comers. Who's getting smaller and not caring about D? No one that's who.
Would love it if somehow all the Atl moves meant Collins was available. But he's not to us after the "questionable" at best moves the idiot made after taking Edwards.
his strategy this offseason confirms (at least IMO) that he really doesn't know what he's doing. total scattergun approach that in one instance makes it look like we're in a rebuild and in another makes it looks like we're vying for a title.
All your hyping here of Beasley over Booker here got the the job done....you should be over the moon ecstatic.
Congrats.....you got exactly what you were hoping for, you nailed it!
Trust The PROSAS...
GO WOLVES!!
only the mind of joda could twist reality into such a pretzel. is this a box of nails ... or is it... a pony? joda will call it whatever the hell he wants.
Rosas did exactly as you had hoped and campaigned for all off-season and now you complain. He can’t help it you don’t like the taste of your own words, try to enjoy and cheer what you asked for. Look at the money, he’s a bargain Booker....you nailed it, look how much better off the Wolves are.
Guess there is just no winning for Rosas. I feel for the guy.
Trust The PROSAS...
Last edited by jodaman01 on Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
Minnesota came into their meeting with Beasley determined to close a deal. The Timberwolves rented a house on the water and brought Beasley’s chef to cook dinner for everyone.
Timberwolves brass on hand included general manager Gersson Rosas, coach Ryan Saunders, assistant general manager Joe Branch, and others, league sources told HoopsHype.
The team showed video highlights of Beasley during his time with the team, messages from Twins star Nelson Cruz, local business owners, customized Vikings jerseys, newspaper cutouts, and more. It left an imprint on Beasley, as well as Rosas and the organization publicly supporting him during his legal situation.
Eroder wrote: ↑Mon Nov 27, 2023 5:13 pm
That settles it. Hoop is right!
Eroder wrote: ↑Wed Dec 13, 2023 12:59 pm
Hoop is right again!!
qrocks wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 9:04 am
Many reasons not to add rubio @$17m and/or Beas @$15m while still not getting a starting PF. Zero reasons to add both without getting a starting PF.
This. Beasley was a must. Young and on the come. I like Rubio and can see him playing well and helping but at what cost? JMac huge cheap find for us. The kind we never find. And what now? No match or Gleague? Great use of assets computer boy. Rubio was not better than him last year and I don't know if he ever was. His extra year makes him 1/20th as tradable as JJ who was our ticket to a bigger deal for a spot we needed. And with no deal we needed him to play minutes at the 4. Great use of assets computer boy.
The idiot showed exactly his mentality with that dumb ass comment about not just checking boxes to check boxes. He does not understand the game or how to build a team. He knows how to cover his ass and feed his own ego. He gets lucky once in a while. Or I should say we get lucky that occasionally those moves coincide with us getting good players. But how many games does a team with the 5 best PG's in the league win. How about team with the 5 best 2 guards? How many players reach their ceiling playing out of position? How many players learn to win by losing? Concepts lost on the idiot. Because we hirfed a guy who doesn't understand the game.
He has a chance to give this headless chicken clown show a little more direction if he would just dump Hermanmunster, give Spellman and Vandy a chance to win playing time, and find the best possible defensive vet 4 that money or assets can buy. No one thinks he will do they? He's still out to prove that 29 teams are idiots. Look around the room. If you can't spot the mark???..............It's you. It's you littleman.
What everyone is forgetting is we now have two contracts that can be packaged to go star hunting if one becomes available. Packing Beasley and Rubio makes money part start at $32M...without these two type of deals ie if we had let Beasley walk (mind you we wouldn’t have had cap space to sign someone to a Beasley level contract) and Johnson’s contract only starting at 16 and then having to package 5 or 6 guys to make the money work completely gutting your roster. This team never was going to have huge cap space, trades is how they are going to have to live so long as KAT and DLo are on team
Minnesota came into their meeting with Beasley determined to close a deal. The Timberwolves rented a house on the water and brought Beasley’s chef to cook dinner for everyone.
Timberwolves brass on hand included general manager Gersson Rosas, coach Ryan Saunders, assistant general manager Joe Branch, and others, league sources told HoopsHype.
The team showed video highlights of Beasley during his time with the team, messages from Twins star Nelson Cruz, local business owners, customized Vikings jerseys, newspaper cutouts, and more. It left an imprint on Beasley, as well as Rosas and the organization publicly supporting him during his legal situation.
It may have actually been an intervention.
Wondering if they took their shirts off and sat in a drum circle and played Kumbaya, sounds beautiful.
Rosas is still star hunting. I don't think he gives a fuck about money. Get stars figue it out layer. Acrue and keep talent to facilitate getting stars.
"Come up off your smooth talk player, this raspy. You stuck on Morse code player, this ASCII."
Sid Hartman wrote: ↑Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:40 am
What everyone is forgetting is we now have two contracts that can be packaged to go star hunting if one becomes available. Packing Beasley and Rubio makes money part start at $32M...without these two type of deals ie if we had let Beasley walk (mind you we wouldn’t have had cap space to sign someone to a Beasley level contract) and Johnson’s contract only starting at 16 and then having to package 5 or 6 guys to make the money work completely gutting your roster. This team never was going to have huge cap space, trades is how they are going to have to live so long as KAT and DLo are on team
Good points.
thinktank wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:15 am
I’m a successful consultant for some of the biggest and best companies in the world. I tell you about systems architecture, not the other way around.
