Not when they have that nany years. Name a guy who was a top get traded for pure crap like the Wolves have other than Dlo and Kat that had as many years left on contract as Booker does.
It's one thing when teams know their deal is coming up. You think Booker is going to sit out the next 4 years?
There is some team out there willing to give up more than the wolves have to give minus Towns Dlo and #3 pick to take a risk on a guy who is signed long term. The Suns could give a shit where he wants to go as he won't be their problem anymore.
But what team is going to give up that great asset for a player who doesn’t want to be there?
It doesn't have to be "Great" The Wolves have absolutely nothing to make thag trade without that top pick.
Virtually anyone can outdo them without giving up much.
Who's to say some team like Boston, Miami etc doesn't step in. Do you think he is going to mind going to a yearly contender with other stars in a city like Miami etc?
I'm sure he will get over it. Let's not forget Karl wasn't DLos first choice either when he had a chance to go to a winner.
Move will include this years lotto pick if Booker is to ever come here. I hope we don't make that move but I can see it possibly happening.
I have no idea if he’d go to Boston. I have no idea if he even wants to be here this bad. My point is IF he really wants it at the exclusion of all else, it will happen. I’ve said nothing about compensation (other than he can lower his value by making it known he only wants to come here).
Obviously, IF he’s willing to go elsewhere then nothing I’ve said matters. It’s only IF the bond between he, Towns, and Russell is as strong as some think and IF he is committed to playing with them above all else. IF not, then whatever. It’s an “IF/THEN” statement. Remove the first condition and the second is invalidated.
“When stupidity is considered patriotism, it is unsafe to be intelligent.”
But what team is going to give up that great asset for a player who doesn’t want to be there?
It doesn't have to be "Great" The Wolves have absolutely nothing to make thag trade without that top pick.
Virtually anyone can outdo them without giving up much.
Who's to say some team like Boston, Miami etc doesn't step in. Do you think he is going to mind going to a yearly contender with other stars in a city like Miami etc?
I'm sure he will get over it. Let's not forget Karl wasn't DLos first choice either when he had a chance to go to a winner.
Move will include this years lotto pick if Booker is to ever come here. I hope we don't make that move but I can see it possibly happening.
I have no idea if he’d go to Boston. I have no idea if he even wants to be here this bad. My point is IF he really wants it at the exclusion of all else, it will happen. I’ve said nothing about compensation (other than he can lower his value by making it known he only wants to come here).
Obviously, IF he’s willing to go elsewhere then nothing I’ve said matters. It’s only IF the bond between he, Towns, and Russell is as strong as some think and IF he is committed to playing with them above all else. IF not, then whatever. It’s an “IF/THEN” statement. Remove the first condition and the second is invalidated.
I don't care if he says he only wants to play here. The Suns are not giving a guy up on that many years for anything the Wolves have taking away Towns, Russell and #3. That's fine if you don't agree.
So you are saying they will get him with what's on the Wolves roster now without either of those 3 added in. Never going to happen imo. We will see.
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
It doesn't have to be "Great" The Wolves have absolutely nothing to make thag trade without that top pick.
Virtually anyone can outdo them without giving up much.
Who's to say some team like Boston, Miami etc doesn't step in. Do you think he is going to mind going to a yearly contender with other stars in a city like Miami etc?
I'm sure he will get over it. Let's not forget Karl wasn't DLos first choice either when he had a chance to go to a winner.
Move will include this years lotto pick if Booker is to ever come here. I hope we don't make that move but I can see it possibly happening.
I have no idea if he’d go to Boston. I have no idea if he even wants to be here this bad. My point is IF he really wants it at the exclusion of all else, it will happen. I’ve said nothing about compensation (other than he can lower his value by making it known he only wants to come here).
Obviously, IF he’s willing to go elsewhere then nothing I’ve said matters. It’s only IF the bond between he, Towns, and Russell is as strong as some think and IF he is committed to playing with them above all else. IF not, then whatever. It’s an “IF/THEN” statement. Remove the first condition and the second is invalidated.
I don't care if he says he only wants to play here. The Suns are not giving a guy up on that many years for anything the Wolves have taking away Towns, Russell and #3. That's fine if you don't agree.
So you are saying they will get him with what's on the Wolves roster now without either of those 3 added in. Never going to happen imo. We will see.
I like you, but fucking pay attention once in a while.
“When stupidity is considered patriotism, it is unsafe to be intelligent.”
I have no idea if he’d go to Boston. I have no idea if he even wants to be here this bad. My point is IF he really wants it at the exclusion of all else, it will happen. I’ve said nothing about compensation (other than he can lower his value by making it known he only wants to come here).
Obviously, IF he’s willing to go elsewhere then nothing I’ve said matters. It’s only IF the bond between he, Towns, and Russell is as strong as some think and IF he is committed to playing with them above all else. IF not, then whatever. It’s an “IF/THEN” statement. Remove the first condition and the second is invalidated.
I don't care if he says he only wants to play here. The Suns are not giving a guy up on that many years for anything the Wolves have taking away Towns, Russell and #3. That's fine if you don't agree.
So you are saying they will get him with what's on the Wolves roster now without either of those 3 added in. Never going to happen imo. We will see.
I like you, but fucking pay attention once in a while.
I am. I have been arguing that they won't get him without the #3 included and you are saying if Booker demands to come here, we can get him without giving any of those 3 things up.
So tell me what they would take minus those 3 that we have?
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
Luckily if this move doesn't happen this off season, it's likely to never happen.
The Wolves have nothing to obtain him other than this top pick. If the Wolves pick someone at #3 and they show any glimer of hope at all, they would be stupid to trade a cheap player away. If the guy they pick looks like another Culver by seasons end, nobody is giving up Booker.
Basically imo if the Wolves start the season with their top pick, the trade won't happen. If it's going to happen it will go down this Summer.
This is the NBA. If Booker decides he wants to play with Towns and Russel in Minnesota, he will. It’s just a matter of time.
No. Phoenix can ship him off to however the highest bidder is. This isn't a guy with his contract running out. He's signed up long term. He really doesn't have a say.
They are not giving him up for any of the crap the Wolves have as Russell and Kat are nit going anywhere. #3 will absolutely have to be involved.
Unless the Wolves suck complete ass again this coming season and they have a good pick again which is completely possible but you would hope they are improved.
I don't care if he says he only wants to play here. The Suns are not giving a guy up on that many years for anything the Wolves have taking away Towns, Russell and #3. That's fine if you don't agree.
So you are saying they will get him with what's on the Wolves roster now without either of those 3 added in. Never going to happen imo. We will see.
I like you, but fucking pay attention once in a while.
I am. I have been arguing that they won't get him without the #3 included and you are saying if Booker demands to come here, we can get him without giving any of those 3 things up.
So tell me what they would take minus those 3 that we have?
I agree that it'd be centred around the pick and Beasley.
I like you, but fucking pay attention once in a while.
I am. I have been arguing that they won't get him without the #3 included and you are saying if Booker demands to come here, we can get him without giving any of those 3 things up.
So tell me what they would take minus those 3 that we have?
I agree that it'd be centred around the pick and Beasley.
Does Phoenix want to offload anything?
Not sure. I would don't want to trade for Booker. I think there are guys in this draft who will be better than Booker.
The Wolves will have literally no one besides those 3 and a bunch of scrubs.
I don't see that group ever being anything better than a #6 seed in the current West landscape and that's pushing.
I can see those 3 missing the playoffs more than making it. They play no defense and none of them have proven to be winners at this level.
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
I don't care if he says he only wants to play here. The Suns are not giving a guy up on that many years for anything the Wolves have taking away Towns, Russell and #3. That's fine if you don't agree.
So you are saying they will get him with what's on the Wolves roster now without either of those 3 added in. Never going to happen imo. We will see.
I like you, but fucking pay attention once in a while.
I am. I have been arguing that they won't get him without the #3 included and you are saying if Booker demands to come here, we can get him without giving any of those 3 things up.
So tell me what they would take minus those 3 that we have?
No I didn’t.
I have no idea what it will cost. But it will happen if he wants to be here and we want him here.
“When stupidity is considered patriotism, it is unsafe to be intelligent.”
i just bristle big time at the reasoning for adding booker. there are other players in the league who can score and play much better D - but the target is booker because.... KAT and Dlo and booker are buddies? it's literally the stupidest reason i can think of for adding a $30M per year player. fuckin A, KAT - expand your friendships maybe.
said earlier in another thread - if we drop in the lottery, and all the decent PF options are gone by the time we pick - but wiseman is still available - i'd call boston and see what package they could offer us (centered around jaylen brown). IMO he's a much better two way player than booker - a lot cheaper - can play both wing spots - and really coming into his own.
why would boston think about it? they still would have kemba, hayward and tatum - plus smart, ojeyele and high draft pick langford from last year. plus two more first rounders this year - and wings are always the most plentiful commodity in the draft. brown would be a loss, but one they could adjust to. OTOH, their C spot is held down by enes kanter, daniel theis, tacko fall, etc. wiseman would easily be the most talented of that group and someone that the celts could build around for years to come. on our end, KAT and wiseman would not be a good pairing - neither can play the 4.
long story short - if we're moving pieces around again - i would waaaaaay rather wind up with a guy like jaylen brown than with devin booker. and if only to emphasize to KAT and Dlo that, no, you don't get every whim granted. win some games first and we'll talk.
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
somuchyummy wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 8:09 am
i just bristle big time at the reasoning for adding booker. there are other players in the league who can score and play much better D - but the target is booker because.... KAT and Dlo and booker are buddies? it's literally the stupidest reason i can think of for adding a $30M per year player. fuckin A, KAT - expand your friendships maybe.
said earlier in another thread - if we drop in the lottery, and all the decent PF options are gone by the time we pick - but wiseman is still available - i'd call boston and see what package they could offer us (centered around jaylen brown). IMO he's a much better two way player than booker - a lot cheaper - can play both wing spots - and really coming into his own.
why would boston think about it? they still would have kemba, hayward and tatum - plus smart, ojeyele and high draft pick langford from last year. plus two more first rounders this year - and wings are always the most plentiful commodity in the draft. brown would be a loss, but one they could adjust to. OTOH, their C spot is held down by enes kanter, daniel theis, tacko fall, etc. wiseman would easily be the most talented of that group and someone that the celts could build around for years to come. on our end, KAT and wiseman would not be a good pairing - neither can play the 4.
long story short - if we're moving pieces around again - i would waaaaaay rather wind up with a guy like jaylen brown than with devin booker. and if only to emphasize to KAT and Dlo that, no, you don't get every whim granted. win some games first and we'll talk.
I don’t believe you should view it as a situation where you are appeasing DLO and KAT as a couple of spoiled brats, that seems petty. Teams with the best talent tend to win, that’s why even the best talent now demands that they have one or two other superstars next to them.
Booker is a big time talent - yes a bigger talent than Beasley. The thought of Booker teamed with DLO and KAT is beyond anything the Wolves have put together since Marbury, KG and Googs. I say that because their ages and potential to grow together is the closest comparison in Wolves history IMO. Timeline has become such a huge term and concept in team building in the NBA, the timeline doesn’t get any more perfect for DLO, KAT and Booker together.
I wouldn’t argue with Brown being a better player or fit (I like him as well), and again I like Beasley. I have just come to the conclusion that if the opportunity is somehow there to make this happen, why not do it? They would potentially give a lot of upside for long time and it would be one of the most exciting things this franchise has ever done and shock the shit not only out of the fanbase but also the entire NBA.
I doubt it ever comes close to happening, but man I would be all in if it did.
I have no idea if he’d go to Boston. I have no idea if he even wants to be here this bad. My point is IF he really wants it at the exclusion of all else, it will happen. I’ve said nothing about compensation (other than he can lower his value by making it known he only wants to come here).
Obviously, IF he’s willing to go elsewhere then nothing I’ve said matters. It’s only IF the bond between he, Towns, and Russell is as strong as some think and IF he is committed to playing with them above all else. IF not, then whatever. It’s an “IF/THEN” statement. Remove the first condition and the second is invalidated.
I don't care if he says he only wants to play here. The Suns are not giving a guy up on that many years for anything the Wolves have taking away Towns, Russell and #3. That's fine if you don't agree.
So you are saying they will get him with what's on the Wolves roster now without either of those 3 added in. Never going to happen imo. We will see.
I like you, but fucking pay attention once in a while.
How did Paul George get to the Clippers!?!?! I'm convinced too if Booker wanted to be here, EVENTUALLY he would end up here.
I like that the Wolves have a guy on the roster (for now) that might be able to do some of the things Booker does... I don't know if salaries were equal that I'd take Beasley over Booker though like it seems some are saying. Booker did get into the all-star game last year because of injury... what are the chances Beasley is ever an all-star in this league? Now if you're saying keep Beasley because he's more affordable etc that's a fair argument. I don't think either one are defensive stoppers.
thinktank wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:15 am
I’m a successful consultant for some of the biggest and best companies in the world. I tell you about systems architecture, not the other way around.
I don't care if he says he only wants to play here. The Suns are not giving a guy up on that many years for anything the Wolves have taking away Towns, Russell and #3. That's fine if you don't agree.
So you are saying they will get him with what's on the Wolves roster now without either of those 3 added in. Never going to happen imo. We will see.
I like you, but fucking pay attention once in a while.
How did Paul George get to the Clippers!?!?! I'm convinced too if Booker wanted to be here, EVENTUALLY he would end up here.
I like that the Wolves have a guy on the roster (for now) that might be able to do some of the things Booker does... I don't know if salaries were equal that I'd take Beasley over Booker though like it seems some are saying. Booker did get into the all-star game last year because of injury... what are the chances Beasley is ever an all-star in this league? Now if you're saying keep Beasley because he's more affordable etc that's a fair argument. I don't think either one are defensive stoppers.
if beasley signs, for example, a four year $64M deal with us in the off season - that's about half of what we'd be paying booker. all things equal, booker is probably a better player. but all things aren't equal - and that extra $15M per year we'd be saving can buy some other talent that we won't have the option to with booker on the payroll.
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
I like you, but fucking pay attention once in a while.
How did Paul George get to the Clippers!?!?! I'm convinced too if Booker wanted to be here, EVENTUALLY he would end up here.
I like that the Wolves have a guy on the roster (for now) that might be able to do some of the things Booker does... I don't know if salaries were equal that I'd take Beasley over Booker though like it seems some are saying. Booker did get into the all-star game last year because of injury... what are the chances Beasley is ever an all-star in this league? Now if you're saying keep Beasley because he's more affordable etc that's a fair argument. I don't think either one are defensive stoppers.
if beasley signs, for example, a four year $64M deal with us in the off season - that's about half of what we'd be paying booker. all things equal, booker is probably a better player. but all things aren't equal - and that extra $15M per year we'd be saving can buy some other talent that we won't have the option to with booker on the payroll.
How will they add that guy if you're at or above the cap then? But your argument is a fair one... spend less in hopes of similar production though I haven't seen that YET.
thinktank wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:15 am
I’m a successful consultant for some of the biggest and best companies in the world. I tell you about systems architecture, not the other way around.
eh, you're probably right. i just find it hard to stomach a situation where we'd have an average of $93M tied up for three straight years into just three big minutes players - none of whom can play D. is it an exciting team on paper? or in some video game? i suppose. but in the real world i think we'll just get squashed.
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
somuchyummy wrote: ↑Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:58 pm
eh, you're probably right. i just find it hard to stomach a situation where we'd have an average of $93M tied up for three straight years into just three big minutes players - none of whom can play D. is it an exciting team on paper? or in some video game? i suppose. but in the real world i think we'll just get squashed.
On top of it I don't think these 3 have enough heart either. It's like having 3 Kyrie Irvings that are not as good as Kyrie.
Hard pass!
Rosas came out great on the Russell deal as Wiggins wasn't working out here.
Don't go messing it up by giving up big assets. We need to come away with the right player for once in the draft.
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
Wolves PR now spinning Beasley. I liked Beasley provided in his short stint, but I am leery of over inflating - especially when I have seen how the Wolves PR spins and over inflates even the most minuscule glimmer of anything positive.
This is likely preparing the fans for a ridiculous offer being prepared by the Wolves for Beasley.
we should offer him about $16M per year - 3 maybe 4 years. that should do it. he knows he's getting PT here - which he wasn't in denver. wolves are the team ready to offer him a big role - he should take it.
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
somuchyummy wrote: ↑Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:56 pm
we should offer him about $16M per year - 3 maybe 4 years. that should do it. he knows he's getting PT here - which he wasn't in denver. wolves are the team ready to offer him a big role - he should take it.
That seems reasonable, but what NBA contract ends up being reasonable these days?
They also need to give him a bigger deal to make sure he matches up better with the Booker contract so we don’t have to give up the rest of our team or a bunch of junk the Suns don’t want to get him....
Corre Ricky Corre wrote: ↑Thu Jun 11, 2020 11:10 am
If Beasley signs for 12-13mil I will be jumping for joy. That is a steal.
i'd love that too - because that would probably mean a longer deal, right? and he's only 23. would love to have a hard working, good shooting guard tied up with reasonable money for awhile. let's the team grow a bit instead of always going to plan B, then C, then J, then Y, then ....
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
Love Beasley. I think the only thing I am on the fence with is his defense. He looked a little lost a times. Hoping that's just because of a new team for him.
Corre Ricky Corre wrote: ↑Thu Jun 11, 2020 11:10 am
If Beasley signs for 12-13mil I will be jumping for joy. That is a steal.
i'd love that too - because that would probably mean a longer deal, right? and he's only 23. would love to have a hard working, good shooting guard tied up with reasonable money for awhile. let's the team grow a bit instead of always going to plan B, then C, then J, then Y, then ....
You either get big money for a shorter term, or lesser for a longer. Not sure what Beasley would prefer, but I'd imagine getting a longer contract would provide security for a player who hasn't really had any so far.
And on defense they’re not very different. They’re just not.
agree that booker is better. disagree completely about what that means. in a vacuum, yes, he's better - but on the twolves, no. we already have two very good creative scorers who can get mid-25s every night on this team. beasley is the third wheel who thrives playing off the ball in that situation - getting 18+ while not cutting into KAT and Dlo's numbers. (which is what a ball dominant guy like booker would do.) beasley is a hardworking, opportunistic beneficiary of playing off those two - unlike what we saw with andrew, which was a guy who stood around watching until it was "his turn". i foresee the same sort of logjam pecking order kluge with booker on the team.
watch booker, KAT and dlo all average 23 ppg (total 69) - and then watch KAT and Dlo average 25 ppg - and beasley average 18 ppg (total 68). you seriously want to spend that much more cash to add a point?
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
And on defense they’re not very different. They’re just not.
agree that booker is better. disagree completely about what that means. in a vacuum, yes, he's better - but on the twolves, no. we already have two very good creative scorers who can get mid-25s every night on this team. beasley is the third wheel who thrives playing off the ball in that situation - getting 18+ while not cutting into KAT and Dlo's numbers. (which is what a ball dominant guy like booker would do.) beasley is a hardworking, opportunistic beneficiary of playing off those two - unlike what we saw with andrew, which was a guy who stood around watching until it was "his turn". i foresee the same sort of logjam pecking order kluge with booker on the team.
watch booker, KAT and dlo all average 23 ppg (total 69) - and then watch KAT and Dlo average 25 ppg - and beasley average 18 ppg (total 68). you seriously want to spend that much more cash to add a point?
Well, I disagree with you that scoring distribution is the right way to look at it.
Booker, if acquired, is the best scorer on the team, in the sense that, in the 4th quarter, he would be the best option to be able to either score, get to the FT line (91%—wow), or pull gravity to create an opportunity for KAT or DLo.
The game isn’t won on paper. To win during crunch time, we need a true triple threat player who can either shoot, dribble, or pass. Booker is that threat and Beasley is not (because Beasley can’t dribble or pass).
And on defense they’re not very different. They’re just not.
agree that booker is better. disagree completely about what that means. in a vacuum, yes, he's better - but on the twolves, no. we already have two very good creative scorers who can get mid-25s every night on this team. beasley is the third wheel who thrives playing off the ball in that situation - getting 18+ while not cutting into KAT and Dlo's numbers. (which is what a ball dominant guy like booker would do.) beasley is a hardworking, opportunistic beneficiary of playing off those two - unlike what we saw with andrew, which was a guy who stood around watching until it was "his turn". i foresee the same sort of logjam pecking order kluge with booker on the team.
watch booker, KAT and dlo all average 23 ppg (total 69) - and then watch KAT and Dlo average 25 ppg - and beasley average 18 ppg (total 68). you seriously want to spend that much more cash to add a point?
Well, I disagree with you that scoring distribution is the right way to look at it.
Booker, if acquired, is the best scorer on the team, in the sense that, in the 4th quarter, he would be the best option to be able to either score, get to the FT line (91%—wow), or pull gravity to create an opportunity for KAT or DLo.
The game isn’t won on paper. To win during crunch time, we need a true triple threat player who can either shoot, dribble, or pass. Booker is that threat and Beasley is not (because Beasley can’t dribble or pass).
These two arguments sum it up pretty well, and why I fall on the side of getting Booker if the opportunity presented itself.
You can’t worry if having 3 stars means they are going to steal offense from each other. You need to believe the three will learn to play to each other’s strengths and make the team better. I believe those three together may have the right chemistry to do that.
I won’t bitch about Beasley at a lower price than Booker if there is no feasible way to get Booker, Beasley appears to be a nice player and it would leave more money to get stronger players at the PF position if Rosas really wants to do that (which unfortunately I don’t believe he does). Although it’s a good argument, but it no doubt feels like a “settle”.
If the Suns are willing to deal Booker, I dump or switch Picks, and anyone not nicknamed DLO or KAT to get it done.
Rosas puts his stamp on the franchise for the next 3 or 4 years if he pulls it off, And gives himself a real chance at a successful new chapter in Wolves history.
And on defense they’re not very different. They’re just not.
agree that booker is better. disagree completely about what that means. in a vacuum, yes, he's better - but on the twolves, no. we already have two very good creative scorers who can get mid-25s every night on this team. beasley is the third wheel who thrives playing off the ball in that situation - getting 18+ while not cutting into KAT and Dlo's numbers. (which is what a ball dominant guy like booker would do.) beasley is a hardworking, opportunistic beneficiary of playing off those two - unlike what we saw with andrew, which was a guy who stood around watching until it was "his turn". i foresee the same sort of logjam pecking order kluge with booker on the team.
watch booker, KAT and dlo all average 23 ppg (total 69) - and then watch KAT and Dlo average 25 ppg - and beasley average 18 ppg (total 68). you seriously want to spend that much more cash to add a point?
Well, I disagree with you that scoring distribution is the right way to look at it.
Booker, if acquired, is the best scorer on the team, in the sense that, in the 4th quarter, he would be the best option to be able to either score, get to the FT line (91%—wow), or pull gravity to create an opportunity for KAT or DLo.
The game isn’t won on paper. To win during crunch time, we need a true triple threat player who can either shoot, dribble, or pass. Booker is that threat and Beasley is not (because Beasley can’t dribble or pass).
see i think we already have two of those "triple threat" players in KAT and DLo. if neither of those guys can get you a basket in crunch time, something's amiss. that's their skill set and they are both very good at it. while beasley isn't as good of a creater as booker, he still very much has to be accounted for because of his deep ball - and that's all you need to help KAT and Dlo. in the past, people almost dared us to pass the ball to andrew because he wasn't a reliable deep threat plus he didn't know how to put the ball on the floor. beasley is entirely a different cat because teams know he's a deadly deep ball guy. booker seems like entirely a $30M redundancy in light of that.
i'll add this. we pay KAT $30M+ as one of the most multi-dimensional elite big man scorers the nba has ever seen. you think we need to add another $30M+ guy to take the ball out of his hands at crunch time? especially when he's already got an aggressive deep ball threat like beasley and an all around scoring threat like DLo with him on the floor? it's frankly absurd logic.
There is little difference between the memory of a real event and the memory of a dream.
