Zach talks to Minnesota Timberwolves coach Ryan Saunders about building around Karl-Anthony Towns, the legacy of his father, Flip, being Kevin Garnett's ball kid, Sam Cassell's trash talk, and much more.
"Butler gone and Wiggins with a chip on his shoulder: All Star this season potential." -Unfadeable21
"It's would you rather have Wiggins or Kyrie? I'm taking Wiggins." - Sergeant Rubetube
Didn't listen, but I really wish they'd leave the Flip thing alone at this point. By now everyone has made the Flip connection, constantly bringing it up only makes it harder for Ryan to do his job.
Let Ryan be his own man and build his own legacy.
2020 All Time NBA Draft
A Iverson, K Irving
J Havlicek, M Ginobili, M Richmond
D Wilkins, B Bowen
T Duncan, B McAdoo
H Olajuwon, W Unseld, A Sabonis
Some good stories about KG, Saunders spewing the tired company line when asked about Wiggins (he has so much talent, you should see him in practice, blah blah, blah...). One thing I didn't know, was that Ryan has been buddies with Gersson for about 8 years. Also, Ryan seems to put a little too much buddy-buddy stock into coaching players, IMO. I believe it is very important, but time will tell if Ryan can be tough enough to actually make a difference.
"Butler gone and Wiggins with a chip on his shoulder: All Star this season potential." -Unfadeable21
"It's would you rather have Wiggins or Kyrie? I'm taking Wiggins." - Sergeant Rubetube
Decker23 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:35 am
Some good stories about KG, Saunders spewing the tired company line when asked about Wiggins (he has so much talent, you should see him in practice, blah blah, blah...). One thing I didn't know, was that Ryan has been buddies with Gersson for about 8 years. Also, Ryan seems to put a little too much buddy-buddy stock into coaching players, IMO. I believe it is very important, but time will tell if Ryan can be tough enough to actually make a difference.
I do agree in general, but I think for him specifically, it does make a difference with this team.
*We've had a big problem of recent finding a coach that can connect with our young players and bring out the best of them. But for whatever reason they seem to respond to Ryan and support him as HC.
*Ryan has a glaring hole in his resume compared to other equal HC candidates, so when he was interviewing he had to be able to demonstrate a tangible thing that he can point to to help offset that.
We'll see what ends up happening though. Eventually the buddy/buddy thing only gets you so far, so you have to be able to still keep professional boundaries and constantly evolve the relationship if it's going to work long term.
2020 All Time NBA Draft
A Iverson, K Irving
J Havlicek, M Ginobili, M Richmond
D Wilkins, B Bowen
T Duncan, B McAdoo
H Olajuwon, W Unseld, A Sabonis
The knowing Gersson bit for 8 years was interesting, as well as the app they created. The last bit about Cassell, Wiggins, Okogie, and summer workouts was interesting. But the bulk of it was stories told elsewhere. Worth the listen if you're sitting at work.
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I'm not as concerned about the "buddy-buddy" bit as others. Players have to want to play for their coach, have to be interested and feel like their "boss" gives a shit about their success. The tired screams of guys like Mitchell and Thibs are played out.
You need players that want to do it, not feel like they have to.
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j2j wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:46 am
I'm not as concerned about the "buddy-buddy" bit as others. Players have to want to play for their coach, have to be interested and feel like their "boss" gives a shit about their success. The tired screams of guys like Mitchell and Thibs are played out.
You need players that want to do it, not feel like they have to.
I am surprised that it took so long for the consensus to be this ideology. I mean, I thought the "yell at your players until they were on the verge of tears" was played out back in 1991.
j2j wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:46 am
I'm not as concerned about the "buddy-buddy" bit as others. Players have to want to play for their coach, have to be interested and feel like their "boss" gives a shit about their success. The tired screams of guys like Mitchell and Thibs are played out.
You need players that want to do it, not feel like they have to.
I am surprised that it took so long for the consensus to be this ideology. I mean, I thought the "yell at your players until they were on the verge of tears" was played out back in 1991.
Agreed, but there's this long held misconception that you're not coaching unless you're screaming. Still see it at the high school level.
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How much failure or success will people place on Saunders this season? People will want to hang him and the org if we start 1-4 saying it was a nepotism hire and classic loser Wolves. I may jump on that boat too but will it be fair?
Moses Scurry wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:54 am
How much failure or success will people place on Saunders this season? People will want to hang him and the org if we start 1-4 saying it was a nepotism hire and classic loser Wolves. I may jump on that boat too but will it be fair?
It'll happen, and I dont think it will be fair.
I want to see the season play out. And I'm less concerned about the overall record this season and more concerned about the development and style of play. Are they making progress...
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Moses Scurry wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:54 am
How much failure or success will people place on Saunders this season? People will want to hang him and the org if we start 1-4 saying it was a nepotism hire and classic loser Wolves. I may jump on that boat too but will it be fair?
It'll happen, and I dont think it will be fair.
I want to see the season play out. And I'm less concerned about the overall record this season and more concerned about the development and style of play. Are they making progress...
That is a level-headed and fair approach to the season.
j2j wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:46 am
I'm not as concerned about the "buddy-buddy" bit as others. Players have to want to play for their coach, have to be interested and feel like their "boss" gives a shit about their success. The tired screams of guys like Mitchell and Thibs are played out.
You need players that want to do it, not feel like they have to.
I am surprised that it took so long for the consensus to be this ideology. I mean, I thought the "yell at your players until they were on the verge of tears" was played out back in 1991.
Agreed, but there's this long held misconception that you're not coaching unless you're screaming. Still see it at the high school level.
I know I've said this already, but there's a HUGE amount of grey area between those two and I don't think anyone mentioning the "buddy-buddy" angle is suggesting they'd prefer some coach who screams a ton as the alternative.
Vendetta11 wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:50 am
I am surprised that it took so long for the consensus to be this ideology. I mean, I thought the "yell at your players until they were on the verge of tears" was played out back in 1991.
Agreed, but there's this long held misconception that you're not coaching unless you're screaming. Still see it at the high school level.
I know I've said this already, but there's a HUGE amount of grey area between those two and I don't think anyone mentioning the "buddy-buddy" angle is suggesting they'd prefer some coach who screams a ton as the alternative.
Well our last two head coaches were over the top screamers, seems to be the comparison being made. I could be misunderstanding the complaint.
I do agree there's a ton of gray area.
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I think the assumed worry is if you are "buddy-buddy" with your players you lose authority over the players. I think (smart) players respect a coach that knows his stuff regardless of demeanor. On one end, players all probably hate Rick Carlisle for example, but they sure as hell know he is a genius so he can get away with his tough act. If Ryan knows his stuff, he can be buddy buddy with who he wants.
Moses Scurry wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:54 am
How much failure or success will people place on Saunders this season? People will want to hang him and the org if we start 1-4 saying it was a nepotism hire and classic loser Wolves. I may jump on that boat too but will it be fair?
Was it fair when people did it to Sam Mitchell? Mitchell also came in on short notice after his good friends death.
Don't worry though, this fan base will give Teh Saunders boy 5 year's worth of excuses.
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
j2j wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:37 am
Nothing new so far, bit of a yawner. Media needs to quit rehashing the same old stories with him. Find a new angle.
There is literally no other angle. It's the reason he has the job.
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
Moses Scurry wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:54 am
How much failure or success will people place on Saunders this season? People will want to hang him and the org if we start 1-4 saying it was a nepotism hire and classic loser Wolves. I may jump on that boat too but will it be fair?
Was it fair when people did it to Sam Mitchell? Mitchell also came in on short notice after his good friends death.
Don't worry though, this fan base will give Teh Saunders boy 5 year's worth of excuses.
For me, with Mitchell and really all coaches/regimes, it's been about the process, not the record. I hated Mitchell's process, same with Thibs. Even though Thibs got us to the playoffs once, I hated the way he went about it and didn't see it as sustainable.
We've been trying to reach you about your car's extended warranty.
Moses Scurry wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:54 am
How much failure or success will people place on Saunders this season? People will want to hang him and the org if we start 1-4 saying it was a nepotism hire and classic loser Wolves. I may jump on that boat too but will it be fair?
Was it fair when people did it to Sam Mitchell? Mitchell also came in on short notice after his good friends death.
Don't worry though, this fan base will give Teh Saunders boy 5 year's worth of excuses.
For me, with Mitchell and really all coaches/regimes, it's been about the process, not the record. I hated Mitchell's process, same with Thibs. Even though Thibs got us to the playoffs once, I hated the way he went about it and didn't see it as sustainable.
I liked Mitchell more than Thibs but it is hard to argue that Thibs gave us a good season when all others have failed to do that in almost two decades. Even Adelman couldn't get it done.
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
j2j wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:37 am
Nothing new so far, bit of a yawner. Media needs to quit rehashing the same old stories with him. Find a new angle.
There is literally no other angle. It's the reason he has the job.
Maybe, but it's lazy reporting. Lowe and Saunders went a little into how long Saunders has known Rosas, like 8 years. That bit was interesting, would have loved to hear more.
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Moses Scurry wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:54 am
How much failure or success will people place on Saunders this season? People will want to hang him and the org if we start 1-4 saying it was a nepotism hire and classic loser Wolves. I may jump on that boat too but will it be fair?
Was it fair when people did it to Sam Mitchell? Mitchell also came in on short notice after his good friends death.
Don't worry though, this fan base will give Teh Saunders boy 5 year's worth of excuses.
It was fair because we saw what he was running and it was brutal. Offense left over from the 50's. A former coach of the year hasn't even sniffed a job since. He does not believe in analytics and basically hated everyone during that season and how dare question him in media interviews. He is his own worst enemy but I'm going to assume you don't see or recall any of that as he's brother mitchell to you.
Moses Scurry wrote: ↑Mon Jul 15, 2019 11:54 am
How much failure or success will people place on Saunders this season? People will want to hang him and the org if we start 1-4 saying it was a nepotism hire and classic loser Wolves. I may jump on that boat too but will it be fair?
Was it fair when people did it to Sam Mitchell? Mitchell also came in on short notice after his good friends death.
Don't worry though, this fan base will give Teh Saunders boy 5 year's worth of excuses.
It was fair because we saw what he was running and it was brutal. Offense left over from the 50's. A former coach of the year hasn't even sniffed a job since. He does not believe in analytics and basically hated everyone during that season and how dare question him in media interviews. He is his own worst enemy but I'm going to assume you don't see or recall any of that as he's brother mitchell to you.
If Saunders does the same, he should be savaged.
Don't worry, Teh Saunders boy is "Minnesota nice" he could win 10 games but will do it with a smile on his face!
He will make sure to give Marney a cliqued ridden interview too!
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
Imagine calling a grown man "boy" over and over because you're still upset about a coach being let go 4 years ago. A coach with only 1 winning season in a terrible division, and an overall losing record.
We've been trying to reach you about your car's extended warranty.
Was it fair when people did it to Sam Mitchell? Mitchell also came in on short notice after his good friends death.
Don't worry though, this fan base will give Teh Saunders boy 5 year's worth of excuses.
It was fair because we saw what he was running and it was brutal. Offense left over from the 50's. A former coach of the year hasn't even sniffed a job since. He does not believe in analytics and basically hated everyone during that season and how dare question him in media interviews. He is his own worst enemy but I'm going to assume you don't see or recall any of that as he's brother mitchell to you.
If Saunders does the same, he should be savaged.
Don't worry, Teh Saunders boy is "Minnesota nice" he could win 10 games but will do it with a smile on his face!
He will make sure to give Marney a cliqued ridden interview too!
I'm from NY, I hate MN nice. It's the logic behind why you hate is all that matter to me. You just hate him because he's a MN boy with ties to the franchise. Give us something of substance.
It was fair because we saw what he was running and it was brutal. Offense left over from the 50's. A former coach of the year hasn't even sniffed a job since. He does not believe in analytics and basically hated everyone during that season and how dare question him in media interviews. He is his own worst enemy but I'm going to assume you don't see or recall any of that as he's brother mitchell to you.
If Saunders does the same, he should be savaged.
Don't worry, Teh Saunders boy is "Minnesota nice" he could win 10 games but will do it with a smile on his face!
He will make sure to give Marney a cliqued ridden interview too!
I'm from NY, I hate MN nice. It's the logic behind why you hate is all that matter to me. You just hate him because he's a MN boy with ties to the franchise. Give us something of substance.
I don't hate him I just don't think he's going to be any good.
Like I said before.. I don't really care as I see this as a Leslie Frazier hire. This team is going to be bad right now so why waste money on a good HC.
Once they get the roster in better order in the next couple year's, that's when I think they will moge on from him anyway.
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
It was fair because we saw what he was running and it was brutal. Offense left over from the 50's. A former coach of the year hasn't even sniffed a job since. He does not believe in analytics and basically hated everyone during that season and how dare question him in media interviews. He is his own worst enemy but I'm going to assume you don't see or recall any of that as he's brother mitchell to you.
If Saunders does the same, he should be savaged.
Don't worry, Teh Saunders boy is "Minnesota nice" he could win 10 games but will do it with a smile on his face!
He will make sure to give Marney a cliqued ridden interview too!
I'm from NY, I hate MN nice. It's the logic behind why you hate is all that matter to me. You just hate him because he's a MN boy with ties to the franchise. Give us something of substance.
And here is something of substance. I wouldn't of minded this move if we didn't see him most of last year. What impressed you about his coaching last yesr? The team sucked under him and is largely the same roster or you could argue it's even worse. What is going to change this year?
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
Don't worry, Teh Saunders boy is "Minnesota nice" he could win 10 games but will do it with a smile on his face!
He will make sure to give Marney a cliqued ridden interview too!
I'm from NY, I hate MN nice. It's the logic behind why you hate is all that matter to me. You just hate him because he's a MN boy with ties to the franchise. Give us something of substance.
And here is something of substance. I wouldn't of minded this move if we didn't see him most of last year. What impressed you about his coaching last yesr? The team sucked under him and is largely the same roster or you could argue it's even worse. What is going to change this year?
Fair enough.
As j2j said, improvement. On top of that, no baffling lineup changes, no allowing Wiggins, among others, to ignore Towns on multiple possessions, decreased long two's, lack of defensive effort is punished, etc.
I wasn't to incredibly pleased with Saunders last season. Took him a month to finally start Saric and it was still part time, about 24 minutes a game. Wiggins was still taking really bad shots, defense tanked (if I recall correctly). And I hated the homer hire.
I'm putting trust into Rosas that he did go through a process and they are on the same page.
