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Carr is Leaving U
- Sid Hartman
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Carr is Leaving U
Is going to test NBA waters but sounds like he is gone even if he doesn’t get NBA grade...little Richie is as good as gone
Zimmer1: seriously you were the sperm that won?
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Carr a NBA talent?!? LOL
“We are nonviolent with people who are nonviolent with us.”
— Malcolm X
The Puppet Master
— Malcolm X
The Puppet Master
- Cripes
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Dude must be failing home ec.
- jffl_commish
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Carr will not be an NBA player for sure. But if he's gone no matter what, it makes keeping Richard this year even more stupid. They have to bite the bullet sooner or later, let's get on with it already.
Let's get Tropical
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Ralph Sampson once declared for the draft too. He'll be back.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
If they made a switch this year, they'd lose Mashburn and Mitchell. How are they going to even find guys to fill spots if people head out? And who is the coach who is coming in here with the current climate? I would expect a coaching change a year from now if they miss the tourney.jffl_commish wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:48 am Carr will not be an NBA player for sure. But if he's gone no matter what, it makes keeping Richard this year even more stupid. They have to bite the bullet sooner or later, let's get on with it already.
- jffl_commish
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Of course they aren't changing now. Way too late. I just don't believe he deserves this job any longer and they're only delaying the inevitable. The team next year is looking to be extremely bad. If Carr returns and the freshmen pan out, maybe. If he leaves, woof.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:32 amIf they made a switch this year, they'd lose Mashburn and Mitchell. How are they going to even find guys to fill spots if people head out? And who is the coach who is coming in here with the current climate? I would expect a coaching change a year from now if they miss the tourney.jffl_commish wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:48 am Carr will not be an NBA player for sure. But if he's gone no matter what, it makes keeping Richard this year even more stupid. They have to bite the bullet sooner or later, let's get on with it already.
Let's get Tropical
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Not you but many have trashed Carr all year now they're saying he matters... loljffl_commish wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:14 amOf course they aren't changing now. Way too late. I just don't believe he deserves this job any longer and they're only delaying the inevitable. The team next year is looking to be extremely bad. If Carr returns and the freshmen pan out, maybe. If he leaves, woof.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:32 amIf they made a switch this year, they'd lose Mashburn and Mitchell. How are they going to even find guys to fill spots if people head out? And who is the coach who is coming in here with the current climate? I would expect a coaching change a year from now if they miss the tourney.jffl_commish wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:48 am Carr will not be an NBA player for sure. But if he's gone no matter what, it makes keeping Richard this year even more stupid. They have to bite the bullet sooner or later, let's get on with it already.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
He was their second best player, and it wasn't close. Yeah, he's inconsistent, but they won a lot of games because of him.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:41 amNot you but many have trashed Carr all year now they're saying he matters... loljffl_commish wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:14 amOf course they aren't changing now. Way too late. I just don't believe he deserves this job any longer and they're only delaying the inevitable. The team next year is looking to be extremely bad. If Carr returns and the freshmen pan out, maybe. If he leaves, woof.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:32 am
If they made a switch this year, they'd lose Mashburn and Mitchell. How are they going to even find guys to fill spots if people head out? And who is the coach who is coming in here with the current climate? I would expect a coaching change a year from now if they miss the tourney.
Let's get Tropical
- Ask Not
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
I appreciate your Gopher knowledge, but you've been saying the same thing about 'if they don't make the tourney' for 5 years.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:32 amIf they made a switch this year, they'd lose Mashburn and Mitchell. How are they going to even find guys to fill spots if people head out? And who is the coach who is coming in here with the current climate? I would expect a coaching change a year from now if they miss the tourney.jffl_commish wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:48 am Carr will not be an NBA player for sure. But if he's gone no matter what, it makes keeping Richard this year even more stupid. They have to bite the bullet sooner or later, let's get on with it already.
No matter when they change, they risk losing recruits, that's how it works. There's no good time to fire him, but he's proven he can't win or recruit well enough here. The huge buyout is gone, get it done.
Ketchup can be nuancy
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
I probably have for five years because it seems like every other year he's been on the chopping block and then has a pick me up season to get himself another year or two. What was the first realistic year they were going to fire Pitino? For me, I believe it was 16-17 when Coffey was a freshman and they ended up making the tournament. Did you really think they were going to fire him after 15-16 when they were so terrible but had a decent class coming in plus two transfers sitting out.Ask Not wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:07 pmI appreciate your Gopher knowledge, but you've been saying the same thing about 'if they don't make the tourney' for 5 years.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:32 amIf they made a switch this year, they'd lose Mashburn and Mitchell. How are they going to even find guys to fill spots if people head out? And who is the coach who is coming in here with the current climate? I would expect a coaching change a year from now if they miss the tourney.jffl_commish wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 8:48 am Carr will not be an NBA player for sure. But if he's gone no matter what, it makes keeping Richard this year even more stupid. They have to bite the bullet sooner or later, let's get on with it already.
No matter when they change, they risk losing recruits, that's how it works. There's no good time to fire him, but he's proven he can't win or recruit well enough here. The huge buyout is gone, get it done.
17-18 maybe because things went so bad but I believe the buyout was 5 mil, not happening.
18-19 I Thought he was for sure gone until they went on that run to close out the year. I still thought the draw of someone like Eric Mussleman would be fine if Coyle was ready to make a switch.
19-20 a bubble team at best once Coffey announces he isn't coming back. A slow start in non conference and then a piss poor finish in conference really hurt. Like a year ago, I understand if they make a switch but it has to be a no brainer hire, and this time I think the best Coyle could do was maybe a Craig Smith or Niko Medved. Now the climate in the world changes completely (during the big ten tournament!), who knows what the financial ramifications are going forward in the world. At that point I accept that Pitino and his current incoming recruits are what will shape the roster for next year. The 2021 local class is decent, not great. The 2022 class is GREAT. I still think they are in a good spot if next season doesn't go all that well and Pitino gets fired.
I am waiting to see how this domino of an assistant coach, who fills the last 2-3 scholarships, etc goes. That will build in some expectations for me personally for the program next year. I am not necessarily a Pitino fan (as a coach, as a personality on twitter I think he's fantastic) but I can rationalize in my head what Coyle is thinking.
- Ask Not
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Do you think Pitino has shown that he can finish in the top half of the big ten every other year? That feels like a fairly low bar.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:59 amI probably have for five years because it seems like every other year he's been on the chopping block and then has a pick me up season to get himself another year or two. What was the first realistic year they were going to fire Pitino? For me, I believe it was 16-17 when Coffey was a freshman and they ended up making the tournament. Did you really think they were going to fire him after 15-16 when they were so terrible but had a decent class coming in plus two transfers sitting out.Ask Not wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:07 pmI appreciate your Gopher knowledge, but you've been saying the same thing about 'if they don't make the tourney' for 5 years.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:32 am
If they made a switch this year, they'd lose Mashburn and Mitchell. How are they going to even find guys to fill spots if people head out? And who is the coach who is coming in here with the current climate? I would expect a coaching change a year from now if they miss the tourney.
No matter when they change, they risk losing recruits, that's how it works. There's no good time to fire him, but he's proven he can't win or recruit well enough here. The huge buyout is gone, get it done.
17-18 maybe because things went so bad but I believe the buyout was 5 mil, not happening.
18-19 I Thought he was for sure gone until they went on that run to close out the year. I still thought the draw of someone like Eric Mussleman would be fine if Coyle was ready to make a switch.
19-20 a bubble team at best once Coffey announces he isn't coming back. A slow start in non conference and then a piss poor finish in conference really hurt. Like a year ago, I understand if they make a switch but it has to be a no brainer hire, and this time I think the best Coyle could do was maybe a Craig Smith or Niko Medved. Now the climate in the world changes completely (during the big ten tournament!), who knows what the financial ramifications are going forward in the world. At that point I accept that Pitino and his current incoming recruits are what will shape the roster for next year. The 2021 local class is decent, not great. The 2022 class is GREAT. I still think they are in a good spot if next season doesn't go all that well and Pitino gets fired.
I am waiting to see how this domino of an assistant coach, who fills the last 2-3 scholarships, etc goes. That will build in some expectations for me personally for the program next year. I am not necessarily a Pitino fan (as a coach, as a personality on twitter I think he's fantastic) but I can rationalize in my head what Coyle is thinking.
He's shown me it's more likely 1 out of 4 and then it will likely be a 4th place or worse finish.
If that scenario is true, it's time to try the next guy.
Ketchup can be nuancy
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Can he finish in the 1-7 range every other year? No, it doesn't look like that and I have major doubts they'd make that type of a jump without Oturu next year.Ask Not wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 11:52 amDo you think Pitino has shown that he can finish in the top half of the big ten every other year? That feels like a fairly low bar.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:59 amI probably have for five years because it seems like every other year he's been on the chopping block and then has a pick me up season to get himself another year or two. What was the first realistic year they were going to fire Pitino? For me, I believe it was 16-17 when Coffey was a freshman and they ended up making the tournament. Did you really think they were going to fire him after 15-16 when they were so terrible but had a decent class coming in plus two transfers sitting out.Ask Not wrote: ↑Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:07 pm
I appreciate your Gopher knowledge, but you've been saying the same thing about 'if they don't make the tourney' for 5 years.
No matter when they change, they risk losing recruits, that's how it works. There's no good time to fire him, but he's proven he can't win or recruit well enough here. The huge buyout is gone, get it done.
17-18 maybe because things went so bad but I believe the buyout was 5 mil, not happening.
18-19 I Thought he was for sure gone until they went on that run to close out the year. I still thought the draw of someone like Eric Mussleman would be fine if Coyle was ready to make a switch.
19-20 a bubble team at best once Coffey announces he isn't coming back. A slow start in non conference and then a piss poor finish in conference really hurt. Like a year ago, I understand if they make a switch but it has to be a no brainer hire, and this time I think the best Coyle could do was maybe a Craig Smith or Niko Medved. Now the climate in the world changes completely (during the big ten tournament!), who knows what the financial ramifications are going forward in the world. At that point I accept that Pitino and his current incoming recruits are what will shape the roster for next year. The 2021 local class is decent, not great. The 2022 class is GREAT. I still think they are in a good spot if next season doesn't go all that well and Pitino gets fired.
I am waiting to see how this domino of an assistant coach, who fills the last 2-3 scholarships, etc goes. That will build in some expectations for me personally for the program next year. I am not necessarily a Pitino fan (as a coach, as a personality on twitter I think he's fantastic) but I can rationalize in my head what Coyle is thinking.
He's shown me it's more likely 1 out of 4 and then it will likely be a 4th place or worse finish.
If that scenario is true, it's time to try the next guy.
I'm not necessarily disagreeing that it's time to try another guy but in this current climate, it ain't happening from Coyle. A year from now? Yes. Coyle has started to make public comments about needing to make a real jump next year. Also, based on reports I've read Pitino is going to have some trepidation from potential assistant coaches coming here because he might get fired next year. All of that leads to us saying "well, Coyle should probably just make a switch now"... the issue is -- 1.75 mil to buy PItino out, locate your next coach and pay that buyout + a new contract then swallow hard as your two recruits likely head elsewhere, maybe Carr + Willis aren't back and you're left with.........
- Ask Not
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
I appreciate the discussion. I think the empty seats a year after winning a game in the NCAA tourney has to be weighing on Coyle. A couple decent freshman and a decent transfer leaves them again with 5-7 wins in the Big Ten. Losing this year's recruits shouldn't even be a consideration.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 12:02 pmCan he finish in the 1-7 range every other year? No, it doesn't look like that and I have major doubts they'd make that type of a jump without Oturu next year.Ask Not wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 11:52 amDo you think Pitino has shown that he can finish in the top half of the big ten every other year? That feels like a fairly low bar.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 8:59 am
I probably have for five years because it seems like every other year he's been on the chopping block and then has a pick me up season to get himself another year or two. What was the first realistic year they were going to fire Pitino? For me, I believe it was 16-17 when Coffey was a freshman and they ended up making the tournament. Did you really think they were going to fire him after 15-16 when they were so terrible but had a decent class coming in plus two transfers sitting out.
17-18 maybe because things went so bad but I believe the buyout was 5 mil, not happening.
18-19 I Thought he was for sure gone until they went on that run to close out the year. I still thought the draw of someone like Eric Mussleman would be fine if Coyle was ready to make a switch.
19-20 a bubble team at best once Coffey announces he isn't coming back. A slow start in non conference and then a piss poor finish in conference really hurt. Like a year ago, I understand if they make a switch but it has to be a no brainer hire, and this time I think the best Coyle could do was maybe a Craig Smith or Niko Medved. Now the climate in the world changes completely (during the big ten tournament!), who knows what the financial ramifications are going forward in the world. At that point I accept that Pitino and his current incoming recruits are what will shape the roster for next year. The 2021 local class is decent, not great. The 2022 class is GREAT. I still think they are in a good spot if next season doesn't go all that well and Pitino gets fired.
I am waiting to see how this domino of an assistant coach, who fills the last 2-3 scholarships, etc goes. That will build in some expectations for me personally for the program next year. I am not necessarily a Pitino fan (as a coach, as a personality on twitter I think he's fantastic) but I can rationalize in my head what Coyle is thinking.
He's shown me it's more likely 1 out of 4 and then it will likely be a 4th place or worse finish.
If that scenario is true, it's time to try the next guy.
I'm not necessarily disagreeing that it's time to try another guy but in this current climate, it ain't happening from Coyle. A year from now? Yes. Coyle has started to make public comments about needing to make a real jump next year. Also, based on reports I've read Pitino is going to have some trepidation from potential assistant coaches coming here because he might get fired next year. All of that leads to us saying "well, Coyle should probably just make a switch now"... the issue is -- 1.75 mil to buy PItino out, locate your next coach and pay that buyout + a new contract then swallow hard as your two recruits likely head elsewhere, maybe Carr + Willis aren't back and you're left with.........
I'm guessing these are the reasons Pitino is still around in Coyle's eyes:
1. buyout number
2. Pitino seems to be a genuinely good and articulate guy, the kind you want to see succeed.
3. The woulda/coulda's: Lynch doesn't get kicked, Carr gets to play last year, Coffey comes back for senior season. That could have turned into a nice 5 year run. (But those things didn't happen)
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
I agree on #1. I also think the current climate of the world made it easier for Coyle to say we can't make a change right now.Ask Not wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:10 pmI appreciate the discussion. I think the empty seats a year after winning a game in the NCAA tourney has to be weighing on Coyle. A couple decent freshman and a decent transfer leaves them again with 5-7 wins in the Big Ten. Losing this year's recruits shouldn't even be a consideration.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 12:02 pmCan he finish in the 1-7 range every other year? No, it doesn't look like that and I have major doubts they'd make that type of a jump without Oturu next year.Ask Not wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 11:52 am
Do you think Pitino has shown that he can finish in the top half of the big ten every other year? That feels like a fairly low bar.
He's shown me it's more likely 1 out of 4 and then it will likely be a 4th place or worse finish.
If that scenario is true, it's time to try the next guy.
I'm not necessarily disagreeing that it's time to try another guy but in this current climate, it ain't happening from Coyle. A year from now? Yes. Coyle has started to make public comments about needing to make a real jump next year. Also, based on reports I've read Pitino is going to have some trepidation from potential assistant coaches coming here because he might get fired next year. All of that leads to us saying "well, Coyle should probably just make a switch now"... the issue is -- 1.75 mil to buy PItino out, locate your next coach and pay that buyout + a new contract then swallow hard as your two recruits likely head elsewhere, maybe Carr + Willis aren't back and you're left with.........
I'm guessing these are the reasons Pitino is still around in Coyle's eyes:
1. buyout number
2. Pitino seems to be a genuinely good and articulate guy, the kind you want to see succeed.
3. The woulda/coulda's: Lynch doesn't get kicked, Carr gets to play last year, Coffey comes back for senior season. That could have turned into a nice 5 year run. (But those things didn't happen)
Losing the current recruits has to be consideration though. If Carr and Oturu are out the door, don't Mashburn and Mitchell potentially help you fill those voids? I think so. Again, you make a change and now you're filling the four spots above, the open scholarship that was still available and maybe more if others head out. Willis+Curry are four years in for college, maybe they can grad transfer then too. That scenario is quite scary to envision but I do respect the opinion that says Pitino's 7 year track record isn't good enough, time for a change.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
All Big Ten players? No, I don't think they fill the void. Also, let's say you wait a year ...HeHateMe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:30 pm
I agree on #1. I also think the current climate of the world made it easier for Coyle to say we can't make a change right now.
Losing the current recruits has to be consideration though. If Carr and Oturu are out the door, don't Mashburn and Mitchell potentially help you fill those voids? I think so. Again, you make a change and now you're filling the four spots above, the open scholarship that was still available and maybe more if others head out. Willis+Curry are four years in for college, maybe they can grad transfer then too. That scenario is quite scary to envision but I do respect the opinion that says Pitino's 7 year track record isn't good enough, time for a change.
1. That means they didn't win enough games, again.
2. Those same players could just as easily transfer as not sign this year. If the current coach isn't the guy, go find the one you think is -- that's my perspective.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
I disagree. Players going back as far as Kevin Payton were playing professionally somewhere.bubu dubu. wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 6:55 pmits a little different now with many more professional options.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Are they all big ten next year? No... but they could have the potential to do so down the line. Again, Filling 5-6 spots this spring given the current situation doesn't seem ideal. I understand Coyle's decision but also understand people are ready to move on.Ask Not wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 4:20 pmAll Big Ten players? No, I don't think they fill the void. Also, let's say you wait a year ...HeHateMe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:30 pm
I agree on #1. I also think the current climate of the world made it easier for Coyle to say we can't make a change right now.
Losing the current recruits has to be consideration though. If Carr and Oturu are out the door, don't Mashburn and Mitchell potentially help you fill those voids? I think so. Again, you make a change and now you're filling the four spots above, the open scholarship that was still available and maybe more if others head out. Willis+Curry are four years in for college, maybe they can grad transfer then too. That scenario is quite scary to envision but I do respect the opinion that says Pitino's 7 year track record isn't good enough, time for a change.
1. That means they didn't win enough games, again.
2. Those same players could just as easily transfer as not sign this year. If the current coach isn't the guy, go find the one you think is -- that's my perspective.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Pretty much this, and I'm 100% in the Pitino needs to go camp. It is going to be a little weird next season with a presumed lame duck coach though.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
I don't mean to belabor the point, but what's the difference between this year and a lame-duck next year with a losing record next year. Everyone could transfer, everyone could stay, the new coach could bring the 3 recruits he had in the bag with him to Minnesota -- who knows?jffl_commish wrote: ↑Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:18 amPretty much this, and I'm 100% in the Pitino needs to go camp. It is going to be a little weird next season with a presumed lame duck coach though.
It's always going to be ugly unless you are replacing a coach from a winning program going to an even better situation.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
I believe the deadline is now on 6/15.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Read the post above yours.
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Re: Carr is Leaving U
Transferring to Texas.
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