Beef Supreme wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 10:18 am Bench Reiff and O’Neal.
Sign Josh Kline, TJ Clemmings, and Willie Beavers to pair with Bradbury and Samia for the OL.
Cousins Retires.
Problem solved.
Well played.Beef Supreme wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 10:18 am Bench Reiff and O’Neal.
Sign Josh Kline, TJ Clemmings, and Willie Beavers to pair with Bradbury and Samia for the OL.
Cousins Retires.
Problem solved.
2023 is a long, long time away.... rebuilds in the NFL happen quickly with the right pieces.hategreenticemase wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:55 am 1. Fire Spielman.
2. Fire Zimmer.
3. Fire Kubiak.
4. Patterson interim guy.
Do not give away guys, but actively try and trade following if can get any sort of commensurate value:
1. Reiff
2. Rudolph. Ok, good one, but one can dream.
3. Either S. I really dont want to lose Smith, he is still a very good player, but given Cousins contract, how can this legitimately be anything other than a 2 year rebuild? What good is he to us if we arent good again til 2023?
4. Thielen for same reason as Smith. What good is he to us if we arent good again til 2023?
5. Obviously Cousins, but is that even remotely possible? Or cut him whenever it is the smartest cap date to do it.
Beefie or anyone, what is cap scenario of we traded Cousins?
I totally agree that is normally the case but you are completely missing the point. There is no way they can rebuild in one year as its not just a qb they need, and the real point is, until Cousins contract is cleared, they cant make other moves.HeHateMe wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:58 am2023 is a long, long time away.... rebuilds in the NFL happen quickly with the right pieces.hategreenticemase wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 11:55 am 1. Fire Spielman.
2. Fire Zimmer.
3. Fire Kubiak.
4. Patterson interim guy.
Do not give away guys, but actively try and trade following if can get any sort of commensurate value:
1. Reiff
2. Rudolph. Ok, good one, but one can dream.
3. Either S. I really dont want to lose Smith, he is still a very good player, but given Cousins contract, how can this legitimately be anything other than a 2 year rebuild? What good is he to us if we arent good again til 2023?
4. Thielen for same reason as Smith. What good is he to us if we arent good again til 2023?
5. Obviously Cousins, but is that even remotely possible? Or cut him whenever it is the smartest cap date to do it.
Beefie or anyone, what is cap scenario of we traded Cousins?
Cousins they're stuck with for now.. you can cut him in the first three days of the league year in March and just take his 35 mil cap hit as a dead cap hit I think... that at least makes it easier for 2022 cap hit.
I do agree they need to explore trades.. Rudolph/Reiff/Harris for sure. Not sure I punt on Smith.
https://m.startribune.com/souhan-far-f ... 572789842/Ash Ketchum wrote: ↑Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:43 pm First order of business is to figure out a way to get some team to trade for Kirk Cousins and get a portion of his dead money settled.
Right now, Cousins stands to count a ridiculous $45 million against the cap in 2022, his final year. And that entire 2022 salary is guaranteed on the 3rd day of the league year in 2021. The rub is that if you cut Cousins prior to that 3rd day of the 2021 league year, it hits you with $41 million in dead money.
They are fucked until 2022 is over unless they can get someone to trade for Cousins and take on some of that cap burden (I don’t even know if that’s how it works).
If that's true about cutting him after 2021 for $10 million, that's great. You cut him then.Small Hands wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 12:14 pmhttps://m.startribune.com/souhan-far-f ... 572789842/Ash Ketchum wrote: ↑Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:43 pm First order of business is to figure out a way to get some team to trade for Kirk Cousins and get a portion of his dead money settled.
Right now, Cousins stands to count a ridiculous $45 million against the cap in 2022, his final year. And that entire 2022 salary is guaranteed on the 3rd day of the league year in 2021. The rub is that if you cut Cousins prior to that 3rd day of the 2021 league year, it hits you with $41 million in dead money.
They are fucked until 2022 is over unless they can get someone to trade for Cousins and take on some of that cap burden (I don’t even know if that’s how it works).
He would be a $10 million dead cap hit if they cut him after 2021 according to Souhan in this article.
They need to draft a QB and let him develop in 2021 behind Kirk. After that, cut Kirk and let it roll.
I’d be open to keeping Zim and firing Speilman, but have Zim on a short leash next year. Let the new GM decide on the HC after 2021.
If they fire both Zim and Speilman, I really would like for them to go hard after Bieniemy or Lincoln Riley for HC. I’d offer the brinks truck to KC’s GM or bring in his Assistant GM.
I think the article is wrong.Ash Ketchum wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 1:11 pmIf that's true about cutting him after 2021 for $10 million, that's great. You cut him then.Small Hands wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 12:14 pmhttps://m.startribune.com/souhan-far-f ... 572789842/Ash Ketchum wrote: ↑Sun Oct 18, 2020 9:43 pm First order of business is to figure out a way to get some team to trade for Kirk Cousins and get a portion of his dead money settled.
Right now, Cousins stands to count a ridiculous $45 million against the cap in 2022, his final year. And that entire 2022 salary is guaranteed on the 3rd day of the league year in 2021. The rub is that if you cut Cousins prior to that 3rd day of the 2021 league year, it hits you with $41 million in dead money.
They are fucked until 2022 is over unless they can get someone to trade for Cousins and take on some of that cap burden (I don’t even know if that’s how it works).
He would be a $10 million dead cap hit if they cut him after 2021 according to Souhan in this article.
They need to draft a QB and let him develop in 2021 behind Kirk. After that, cut Kirk and let it roll.
I’d be open to keeping Zim and firing Speilman, but have Zim on a short leash next year. Let the new GM decide on the HC after 2021.
If they fire both Zim and Speilman, I really would like for them to go hard after Bieniemy or Lincoln Riley for HC. I’d offer the brinks truck to KC’s GM or bring in his Assistant GM.
I've heard that his entire 2022 salary becomes guaranteed before the 2021 season, and cutting him before the 2021 season would result in like $41 million in dead cap money, which would be catastrophic.
I don't know which is right now I guess.
The Vikings should keep disastrous guard Dru Samia out of the lineup...
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/301 ... ns#cousins
if that plan includes keeping spielman on as GM-hard pass.mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:03 pm The fix is going to be long and painful, and to tell you the truth, unexpected. But here are the steps we need to take in my opinion.
1. Mike Zimmer and the coaching staff needs to be fired. The only assistant coach I would consider retaining is Patterson. Mike Zimmer, Gary Kubiak, and Dom Zimmer have had their day, and those days were 20+ years ago. I think Zimmer would still be a very competent, and perhaps very good, defensive coordinator. I would even have the balls to ask him if he would take that job. Other people have brought it up, but I wonder what the inclusion of these coaches sons amongst the coaching staff had any impact?
You can argue otherwise, but 80% of Kirk Cousins' problems is that we run a very simplistic offense by even NCAA or some top rated HIGH SCHOOL program standards. It is conservative by design because Mike Zimmer wants to be safe with the football, use time of possession, and win the field position battle. Then his elite defense will snuff the opponents offenses and eventually the field position and grinding will win the day 17-13.
Instead, I hire a younger, offensive minded coach who can bring the full, modern NFL offense to the team's playbook. A guy like Joe Brady who will bring in spread and RPO concepts, along with a complete passing game scheme. There is a risk involved in bringing in a young guy without head coaching experience, but it is the risk that needs to be taken.
2. While this is not the only restructuring that needs to happen, my first move is a complete restructure of Kirk Cousins contract that eliminates the 2022 salary guarantee and restructures his $21 million 2021 base into signing over the next 3 years. Like with Riley Reiff this season, it is a take it or leave it deal and I will eat the entire dead if he refuses. I only want him as a caretaker QB for the 2021 season anyways and with the team tanking there are going to be major cuts of the roster of high salary players it really should not matter.
3. If we are going to tank rebuild, there is going to be a slaughter amongst the top 15 paid players on the team. Including Cousins, I would seriously entertain releasing 10 of them, only keeping Hunter, Kendricks, Pierce, Cook, and Bradbury with Kendricks and Pierce being maybes. Releasing Cousins, Barr, Thielen, Smith, Rudolph, amongst others will be hard because they were great players but for the ownership and future of the team it just isn't the cap hit, it is the hard currency they are paying out without the results. If you are Zygi WIlf do you want to pay Adam Thielen, a very popular player $11.1 million in salary or take a fake $5.4 million cap "hit" (money you have already paid him)?
4. This team is going to have some glaring holes but I think they still have a lot to rebuild around. On offense, they would have Dalvin Cook, Justin Jefferson, Irv Smith, and a reasonable core to build around on the offensive line in ONeil, Cleveland, and Bradbury. On defense you would have Hunter, Pierce, Kendricks, Dantzler, Gladney, and Dye. But this is were the young guys drafted in 2020 and the butt load of draft picks we have in 2021 come into play. We get the 2020 guys on the field, even a 5th round guy like Harrison Hand, and get them reps in practice and in the game. We are tanking for a high pick and firing the coaching staff, so who cares about wins-losses. Experience and evaluation are everything. And we need to do things that the current coaching staff would never even dream of: start Ezra Cleveland not at guard but OT (it is doubtful Cousins is our 2021 QB so who gives a fuck about him, and I am one of the biggest Cousins bobos out there). Feature Irv Smith as a real TE threat throwing the ball down the seams. Start James Lynch. Start Troy Dye if he gets off IR. Try to find a marginal safety free agent and give him rotational time.
5. Of course, with a new offensive minded coaching staff and picking at the top of the draft we will focus on a quarterback prospect in the draft. Hopefully we will be in position to select Justin Fields at a minimum. I trade up for him if it is doable. We go as far and fast as teh coaching staff and that QB can take us.
This. They all need to go.weimy froob wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:10 pmif that plan includes keeping spielman on as GM-hard pass.mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:03 pm The fix is going to be long and painful, and to tell you the truth, unexpected. But here are the steps we need to take in my opinion.
1. Mike Zimmer and the coaching staff needs to be fired. The only assistant coach I would consider retaining is Patterson. Mike Zimmer, Gary Kubiak, and Dom Zimmer have had their day, and those days were 20+ years ago. I think Zimmer would still be a very competent, and perhaps very good, defensive coordinator. I would even have the balls to ask him if he would take that job. Other people have brought it up, but I wonder what the inclusion of these coaches sons amongst the coaching staff had any impact?
You can argue otherwise, but 80% of Kirk Cousins' problems is that we run a very simplistic offense by even NCAA or some top rated HIGH SCHOOL program standards. It is conservative by design because Mike Zimmer wants to be safe with the football, use time of possession, and win the field position battle. Then his elite defense will snuff the opponents offenses and eventually the field position and grinding will win the day 17-13.
Instead, I hire a younger, offensive minded coach who can bring the full, modern NFL offense to the team's playbook. A guy like Joe Brady who will bring in spread and RPO concepts, along with a complete passing game scheme. There is a risk involved in bringing in a young guy without head coaching experience, but it is the risk that needs to be taken.
2. While this is not the only restructuring that needs to happen, my first move is a complete restructure of Kirk Cousins contract that eliminates the 2022 salary guarantee and restructures his $21 million 2021 base into signing over the next 3 years. Like with Riley Reiff this season, it is a take it or leave it deal and I will eat the entire dead if he refuses. I only want him as a caretaker QB for the 2021 season anyways and with the team tanking there are going to be major cuts of the roster of high salary players it really should not matter.
3. If we are going to tank rebuild, there is going to be a slaughter amongst the top 15 paid players on the team. Including Cousins, I would seriously entertain releasing 10 of them, only keeping Hunter, Kendricks, Pierce, Cook, and Bradbury with Kendricks and Pierce being maybes. Releasing Cousins, Barr, Thielen, Smith, Rudolph, amongst others will be hard because they were great players but for the ownership and future of the team it just isn't the cap hit, it is the hard currency they are paying out without the results. If you are Zygi WIlf do you want to pay Adam Thielen, a very popular player $11.1 million in salary or take a fake $5.4 million cap "hit" (money you have already paid him)?
4. This team is going to have some glaring holes but I think they still have a lot to rebuild around. On offense, they would have Dalvin Cook, Justin Jefferson, Irv Smith, and a reasonable core to build around on the offensive line in ONeil, Cleveland, and Bradbury. On defense you would have Hunter, Pierce, Kendricks, Dantzler, Gladney, and Dye. But this is were the young guys drafted in 2020 and the butt load of draft picks we have in 2021 come into play. We get the 2020 guys on the field, even a 5th round guy like Harrison Hand, and get them reps in practice and in the game. We are tanking for a high pick and firing the coaching staff, so who cares about wins-losses. Experience and evaluation are everything. And we need to do things that the current coaching staff would never even dream of: start Ezra Cleveland not at guard but OT (it is doubtful Cousins is our 2021 QB so who gives a fuck about him, and I am one of the biggest Cousins bobos out there). Feature Irv Smith as a real TE threat throwing the ball down the seams. Start James Lynch. Start Troy Dye if he gets off IR. Try to find a marginal safety free agent and give him rotational time.
5. Of course, with a new offensive minded coaching staff and picking at the top of the draft we will focus on a quarterback prospect in the draft. Hopefully we will be in position to select Justin Fields at a minimum. I trade up for him if it is doable. We go as far and fast as teh coaching staff and that QB can take us.
I thought I was the new GM.... but I keep Spielman as the GM. I believe that given the injury situation we had at QB and the team that Mike Zimmer wanted, Spielman has been a quality GM. The team's record over the past decade proves this.weimy froob wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:10 pmif that plan includes keeping spielman on as GM-hard pass.mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:03 pm The fix is going to be long and painful, and to tell you the truth, unexpected. But here are the steps we need to take in my opinion.
1. Mike Zimmer and the coaching staff needs to be fired. The only assistant coach I would consider retaining is Patterson. Mike Zimmer, Gary Kubiak, and Dom Zimmer have had their day, and those days were 20+ years ago. I think Zimmer would still be a very competent, and perhaps very good, defensive coordinator. I would even have the balls to ask him if he would take that job. Other people have brought it up, but I wonder what the inclusion of these coaches sons amongst the coaching staff had any impact?
You can argue otherwise, but 80% of Kirk Cousins' problems is that we run a very simplistic offense by even NCAA or some top rated HIGH SCHOOL program standards. It is conservative by design because Mike Zimmer wants to be safe with the football, use time of possession, and win the field position battle. Then his elite defense will snuff the opponents offenses and eventually the field position and grinding will win the day 17-13.
Instead, I hire a younger, offensive minded coach who can bring the full, modern NFL offense to the team's playbook. A guy like Joe Brady who will bring in spread and RPO concepts, along with a complete passing game scheme. There is a risk involved in bringing in a young guy without head coaching experience, but it is the risk that needs to be taken.
2. While this is not the only restructuring that needs to happen, my first move is a complete restructure of Kirk Cousins contract that eliminates the 2022 salary guarantee and restructures his $21 million 2021 base into signing over the next 3 years. Like with Riley Reiff this season, it is a take it or leave it deal and I will eat the entire dead if he refuses. I only want him as a caretaker QB for the 2021 season anyways and with the team tanking there are going to be major cuts of the roster of high salary players it really should not matter.
3. If we are going to tank rebuild, there is going to be a slaughter amongst the top 15 paid players on the team. Including Cousins, I would seriously entertain releasing 10 of them, only keeping Hunter, Kendricks, Pierce, Cook, and Bradbury with Kendricks and Pierce being maybes. Releasing Cousins, Barr, Thielen, Smith, Rudolph, amongst others will be hard because they were great players but for the ownership and future of the team it just isn't the cap hit, it is the hard currency they are paying out without the results. If you are Zygi WIlf do you want to pay Adam Thielen, a very popular player $11.1 million in salary or take a fake $5.4 million cap "hit" (money you have already paid him)?
4. This team is going to have some glaring holes but I think they still have a lot to rebuild around. On offense, they would have Dalvin Cook, Justin Jefferson, Irv Smith, and a reasonable core to build around on the offensive line in ONeil, Cleveland, and Bradbury. On defense you would have Hunter, Pierce, Kendricks, Dantzler, Gladney, and Dye. But this is were the young guys drafted in 2020 and the butt load of draft picks we have in 2021 come into play. We get the 2020 guys on the field, even a 5th round guy like Harrison Hand, and get them reps in practice and in the game. We are tanking for a high pick and firing the coaching staff, so who cares about wins-losses. Experience and evaluation are everything. And we need to do things that the current coaching staff would never even dream of: start Ezra Cleveland not at guard but OT (it is doubtful Cousins is our 2021 QB so who gives a fuck about him, and I am one of the biggest Cousins bobos out there). Feature Irv Smith as a real TE threat throwing the ball down the seams. Start James Lynch. Start Troy Dye if he gets off IR. Try to find a marginal safety free agent and give him rotational time.
5. Of course, with a new offensive minded coaching staff and picking at the top of the draft we will focus on a quarterback prospect in the draft. Hopefully we will be in position to select Justin Fields at a minimum. I trade up for him if it is doable. We go as far and fast as teh coaching staff and that QB can take us.
How does the teams record over the last decade prove it?mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:28 pmI thought I was the new GM.... but I keep Spielman as the GM. I believe that given the injury situation we had at QB and the team that Mike Zimmer wanted, Spielman has been a quality GM. The team's record over the past decade proves this.weimy froob wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:10 pmif that plan includes keeping spielman on as GM-hard pass.mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:03 pm The fix is going to be long and painful, and to tell you the truth, unexpected. But here are the steps we need to take in my opinion.
1. Mike Zimmer and the coaching staff needs to be fired. The only assistant coach I would consider retaining is Patterson. Mike Zimmer, Gary Kubiak, and Dom Zimmer have had their day, and those days were 20+ years ago. I think Zimmer would still be a very competent, and perhaps very good, defensive coordinator. I would even have the balls to ask him if he would take that job. Other people have brought it up, but I wonder what the inclusion of these coaches sons amongst the coaching staff had any impact?
You can argue otherwise, but 80% of Kirk Cousins' problems is that we run a very simplistic offense by even NCAA or some top rated HIGH SCHOOL program standards. It is conservative by design because Mike Zimmer wants to be safe with the football, use time of possession, and win the field position battle. Then his elite defense will snuff the opponents offenses and eventually the field position and grinding will win the day 17-13.
Instead, I hire a younger, offensive minded coach who can bring the full, modern NFL offense to the team's playbook. A guy like Joe Brady who will bring in spread and RPO concepts, along with a complete passing game scheme. There is a risk involved in bringing in a young guy without head coaching experience, but it is the risk that needs to be taken.
2. While this is not the only restructuring that needs to happen, my first move is a complete restructure of Kirk Cousins contract that eliminates the 2022 salary guarantee and restructures his $21 million 2021 base into signing over the next 3 years. Like with Riley Reiff this season, it is a take it or leave it deal and I will eat the entire dead if he refuses. I only want him as a caretaker QB for the 2021 season anyways and with the team tanking there are going to be major cuts of the roster of high salary players it really should not matter.
3. If we are going to tank rebuild, there is going to be a slaughter amongst the top 15 paid players on the team. Including Cousins, I would seriously entertain releasing 10 of them, only keeping Hunter, Kendricks, Pierce, Cook, and Bradbury with Kendricks and Pierce being maybes. Releasing Cousins, Barr, Thielen, Smith, Rudolph, amongst others will be hard because they were great players but for the ownership and future of the team it just isn't the cap hit, it is the hard currency they are paying out without the results. If you are Zygi WIlf do you want to pay Adam Thielen, a very popular player $11.1 million in salary or take a fake $5.4 million cap "hit" (money you have already paid him)?
4. This team is going to have some glaring holes but I think they still have a lot to rebuild around. On offense, they would have Dalvin Cook, Justin Jefferson, Irv Smith, and a reasonable core to build around on the offensive line in ONeil, Cleveland, and Bradbury. On defense you would have Hunter, Pierce, Kendricks, Dantzler, Gladney, and Dye. But this is were the young guys drafted in 2020 and the butt load of draft picks we have in 2021 come into play. We get the 2020 guys on the field, even a 5th round guy like Harrison Hand, and get them reps in practice and in the game. We are tanking for a high pick and firing the coaching staff, so who cares about wins-losses. Experience and evaluation are everything. And we need to do things that the current coaching staff would never even dream of: start Ezra Cleveland not at guard but OT (it is doubtful Cousins is our 2021 QB so who gives a fuck about him, and I am one of the biggest Cousins bobos out there). Feature Irv Smith as a real TE threat throwing the ball down the seams. Start James Lynch. Start Troy Dye if he gets off IR. Try to find a marginal safety free agent and give him rotational time.
5. Of course, with a new offensive minded coaching staff and picking at the top of the draft we will focus on a quarterback prospect in the draft. Hopefully we will be in position to select Justin Fields at a minimum. I trade up for him if it is doable. We go as far and fast as teh coaching staff and that QB can take us.
This times 3. No brainer, and RS should be the first one to go, period.Sergeant Rubetube wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:24 pmThis. They all need to go.weimy froob wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:10 pmif that plan includes keeping spielman on as GM-hard pass.mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:03 pm The fix is going to be long and painful, and to tell you the truth, unexpected. But here are the steps we need to take in my opinion.
1. Mike Zimmer and the coaching staff needs to be fired. The only assistant coach I would consider retaining is Patterson. Mike Zimmer, Gary Kubiak, and Dom Zimmer have had their day, and those days were 20+ years ago. I think Zimmer would still be a very competent, and perhaps very good, defensive coordinator. I would even have the balls to ask him if he would take that job. Other people have brought it up, but I wonder what the inclusion of these coaches sons amongst the coaching staff had any impact?
You can argue otherwise, but 80% of Kirk Cousins' problems is that we run a very simplistic offense by even NCAA or some top rated HIGH SCHOOL program standards. It is conservative by design because Mike Zimmer wants to be safe with the football, use time of possession, and win the field position battle. Then his elite defense will snuff the opponents offenses and eventually the field position and grinding will win the day 17-13.
Instead, I hire a younger, offensive minded coach who can bring the full, modern NFL offense to the team's playbook. A guy like Joe Brady who will bring in spread and RPO concepts, along with a complete passing game scheme. There is a risk involved in bringing in a young guy without head coaching experience, but it is the risk that needs to be taken.
2. While this is not the only restructuring that needs to happen, my first move is a complete restructure of Kirk Cousins contract that eliminates the 2022 salary guarantee and restructures his $21 million 2021 base into signing over the next 3 years. Like with Riley Reiff this season, it is a take it or leave it deal and I will eat the entire dead if he refuses. I only want him as a caretaker QB for the 2021 season anyways and with the team tanking there are going to be major cuts of the roster of high salary players it really should not matter.
3. If we are going to tank rebuild, there is going to be a slaughter amongst the top 15 paid players on the team. Including Cousins, I would seriously entertain releasing 10 of them, only keeping Hunter, Kendricks, Pierce, Cook, and Bradbury with Kendricks and Pierce being maybes. Releasing Cousins, Barr, Thielen, Smith, Rudolph, amongst others will be hard because they were great players but for the ownership and future of the team it just isn't the cap hit, it is the hard currency they are paying out without the results. If you are Zygi WIlf do you want to pay Adam Thielen, a very popular player $11.1 million in salary or take a fake $5.4 million cap "hit" (money you have already paid him)?
4. This team is going to have some glaring holes but I think they still have a lot to rebuild around. On offense, they would have Dalvin Cook, Justin Jefferson, Irv Smith, and a reasonable core to build around on the offensive line in ONeil, Cleveland, and Bradbury. On defense you would have Hunter, Pierce, Kendricks, Dantzler, Gladney, and Dye. But this is were the young guys drafted in 2020 and the butt load of draft picks we have in 2021 come into play. We get the 2020 guys on the field, even a 5th round guy like Harrison Hand, and get them reps in practice and in the game. We are tanking for a high pick and firing the coaching staff, so who cares about wins-losses. Experience and evaluation are everything. And we need to do things that the current coaching staff would never even dream of: start Ezra Cleveland not at guard but OT (it is doubtful Cousins is our 2021 QB so who gives a fuck about him, and I am one of the biggest Cousins bobos out there). Feature Irv Smith as a real TE threat throwing the ball down the seams. Start James Lynch. Start Troy Dye if he gets off IR. Try to find a marginal safety free agent and give him rotational time.
5. Of course, with a new offensive minded coaching staff and picking at the top of the draft we will focus on a quarterback prospect in the draft. Hopefully we will be in position to select Justin Fields at a minimum. I trade up for him if it is doable. We go as far and fast as teh coaching staff and that QB can take us.
Again, the Vikings have the 12th best record over the past decade in the NFL. That is a more than substantial achievement, particularly when the top 5 teams all had Hall of Fame quarterbacks that almost never were injured. Claining this is meaningless is idiotic.hategreenticemase wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:03 pmThis times 3. No brainer, and RS should be the first one to go, period.Sergeant Rubetube wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:24 pmThis. They all need to go.weimy froob wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 8:10 pm
if that plan includes keeping spielman on as GM-hard pass.
Mlhouse, I like most of your thoughts above but it is beyond ludicrous to suggest RS should stay. Laughable, really.
mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pmAgain, the Vikings have the 12th best record over the past decade in the NFL. That is a more than substantial achievement, particularly when the top 5 teams all had Hall of Fame quarterbacks that almost never were injured. Claining this is meaningless is idiotic.hategreenticemase wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:03 pm
This times 3. No brainer, and RS should be the first one to go, period.
Mlhouse, I like most of your thoughts above but it is beyond ludicrous to suggest RS should stay. Laughable, really.
In this span, the Vikings have had significant injury problems at the QB position that has really cost them a lot of value. That is a critical variable outside the GMs control. If Bridgewater does not blow out his knee, then they can build other positions in the draft around him.
Some specific issues: Mike Hughes. Anyone who claims to be a "Best Player Available" drafter should shut their mouths because that is what this pick was. I also believe it was heavily influenced by the head coach. Hughes' career is probably done because of a serious neck injury and he blew out his ACL his rookie year that probably hindered his development significantly.
Garrett Bradbury: this is an example of not everyone is perfect. I criticized this pick when it was made, presented an alternative scenario that would have been significantly better, and stated this was a mistake by Spielman. Not everything Rick does has been correct.
I would not be adverse to Spielman leaving, but the fact is he has built talent up and down the roster over more than a decade. It would also be refreshing if the criticism of Spielman was actually based on reality, not some Rube's anger because Rick upset their NFL draft viewing by trading down.
Drafted O'Neil in the 2nd, Bradbury in the first, and now Cleveland in the 2nd???? I am not going to claim that those were all the greatest moves, but claiming he has "done nothing" is not the case, right?salamander wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 10:06 pm I was high on Spielman until the last couple years. He's done nothing to fix this trash oline and he shows no signs of doing it anytime soon.
Care to explain how the GM of a team with the 12th best record over the decade he was the GM isn't essentially a top 10 GM? What is really funny is morons like you pretending that we have been some sort of bottom feeder throughout the course of his tenure.RM22 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 10:12 pmmlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pmAgain, the Vikings have the 12th best record over the past decade in the NFL. That is a more than substantial achievement, particularly when the top 5 teams all had Hall of Fame quarterbacks that almost never were injured. Claining this is meaningless is idiotic.hategreenticemase wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:03 pm
This times 3. No brainer, and RS should be the first one to go, period.
Mlhouse, I like most of your thoughts above but it is beyond ludicrous to suggest RS should stay. Laughable, really.
In this span, the Vikings have had significant injury problems at the QB position that has really cost them a lot of value. That is a critical variable outside the GMs control. If Bridgewater does not blow out his knee, then they can build other positions in the draft around him.
Some specific issues: Mike Hughes. Anyone who claims to be a "Best Player Available" drafter should shut their mouths because that is what this pick was. I also believe it was heavily influenced by the head coach. Hughes' career is probably done because of a serious neck injury and he blew out his ACL his rookie year that probably hindered his development significantly.
Garrett Bradbury: this is an example of not everyone is perfect. I criticized this pick when it was made, presented an alternative scenario that would have been significantly better, and stated this was a mistake by Spielman. Not everything Rick does has been correct.
I would not be adverse to Spielman leaving, but the fact is he has built talent up and down the roster over more than a decade. It would also be refreshing if the criticism of Spielman was actually based on reality, not some Rube's anger because Rick upset their NFL draft viewing by trading down.
This is hogwash. Zimmer is much like Denny Green in that he will usually always raise a team to competency and have them be able to compete whether or not they are as talented as others. Green had a great offensive scheme and Zimmer a Def one. Both got players to play hard and be accountable. Greens teams were front runners and not physical and this is one are Zimmer is far better than Green as his team's are physical.mlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pmAgain, the Vikings have the 12th best record over the past decade in the NFL. That is a more than substantial achievement, particularly when the top 5 teams all had Hall of Fame quarterbacks that almost never were injured. Claining this is meaningless is idiotic.hategreenticemase wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:03 pmThis times 3. No brainer, and RS should be the first one to go, period.
Mlhouse, I like most of your thoughts above but it is beyond ludicrous to suggest RS should stay. Laughable, really.
In this span, the Vikings have had significant injury problems at the QB position that has really cost them a lot of value. That is a critical variable outside the GMs control. If Bridgewater does not blow out his knee, then they can build other positions in the draft around him.
Some specific issues: Mike Hughes. Anyone who claims to be a "Best Player Available" drafter should shut their mouths because that is what this pick was. I also believe it was heavily influenced by the head coach. Hughes' career is probably done because of a serious neck injury and he blew out his ACL his rookie year that probably hindered his development significantly.
Garrett Bradbury: this is an example of not everyone is perfect. I criticized this pick when it was made, presented an alternative scenario that would have been significantly better, and stated this was a mistake by Spielman. Not everything Rick does has been correct.
I would not be adverse to Spielman leaving, but the fact is he has built talent up and down the roster over more than a decade. It would also be refreshing if the criticism of Spielman was actually based on reality, not some Rube's anger because Rick upset their NFL draft viewing by trading down.
I'm not the one pretending. You are. He sucks. I've told you he sucks. Countless better players he has missed on. Terrible QB signing. And never fixed the offensive line.mlhouse wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 12:18 amCare to explain how the GM of a team with the 12th best record over the decade he was the GM isn't essentially a top 10 GM? What is really funny is morons like you pretending that we have been some sort of bottom feeder throughout the course of his tenure.RM22 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 10:12 pmmlhouse wrote: ↑Mon Oct 19, 2020 9:53 pm
Again, the Vikings have the 12th best record over the past decade in the NFL. That is a more than substantial achievement, particularly when the top 5 teams all had Hall of Fame quarterbacks that almost never were injured. Claining this is meaningless is idiotic.
In this span, the Vikings have had significant injury problems at the QB position that has really cost them a lot of value. That is a critical variable outside the GMs control. If Bridgewater does not blow out his knee, then they can build other positions in the draft around him.
Some specific issues: Mike Hughes. Anyone who claims to be a "Best Player Available" drafter should shut their mouths because that is what this pick was. I also believe it was heavily influenced by the head coach. Hughes' career is probably done because of a serious neck injury and he blew out his ACL his rookie year that probably hindered his development significantly.
Garrett Bradbury: this is an example of not everyone is perfect. I criticized this pick when it was made, presented an alternative scenario that would have been significantly better, and stated this was a mistake by Spielman. Not everything Rick does has been correct.
I would not be adverse to Spielman leaving, but the fact is he has built talent up and down the roster over more than a decade. It would also be refreshing if the criticism of Spielman was actually based on reality, not some Rube's anger because Rick upset their NFL draft viewing by trading down.
This team wouldn't need to be a two year rebuild. Cousins contract is what necessitates that, as you pointed out, we have to take the gulp on dead money. Unless we can trade him somehow I don't see a way around that as we won't have money to fill other non qb needs. Thus, its a two year deal.Angry Waters wrote: ↑Tue Oct 20, 2020 8:39 am Lots of great stuff in here, if you can sort through the personal attacks...feels like political season LOL. First of all, it's funny how fast shit can turn south. We lost to two good teams (Tenn & Sea) by 1 point each game. Could've easily won both. And even if we would've just beat Seattle, I think we handle Atlanta fairly easily--though you see the 'dead cat bounce' quite often when a team changes coaches. Anyways, the crushing nature of the Seattle defeat is hard to truly quantify. I kinda liken this to Chilly's last year--I don't think anyone could foresee that collapse. But, then again, it's hard to overcome such a crushing defeat like Chilly's team did in New Orleans.
So...I fully expect this to get uglier and uglier. I guess I really looked at Rick/Zim/Kirk being connected at the hip. I've used 'roster prioritization' before when critiquing Spielman...I know he's used relatively high draft capital with Elflein, Bradbury, and Cleveland. Nonetheless, I still contend that either the Barr or the Harris (or both) money should've went to the offensive line considering he's had enough of a sample size with Kirk at QB.
It feels like it's time to fully blow this up--especially since there seems to be some legit long-term answers at QB in the draft. If we go the route of changing the power structure and drafting a QB, I guess I do whatever is possible to get Kirk's contracts off-the-books after 2021. If it means having an enormous cap hit next year but we're free-and-clear in 2022, so be it--we're gonna suck next year on a rebuild, anyways. I would probably look to trade any movable veterans, too--though the trade market for old dudes making big dollars in the NFL isn't very high--too bad--Rick could've probably collected a handful more 7th round picks.
So...how bad does this get? We're not gonna be able to 'usurp' the Jets for Lawrence. So, is it time for 'Feeble for Fields'?